Forums

Search
Forums » Memoir '44 - English » Ken Burns - The War
Show: Today's Posts 
  
AuthorTopic
rasmussen81
DoW Content Provider
Designer's Oath

User Pages
Posts: 7191
Registered:
July 2007
  Ken Burns - The War Mon, 24 September 2007 04:38
Tonight at 8:00 the Public Broadcasting show "Ken Burns The War" is starting a 7-part series about WW2. The series follows the war and it's impact on the people of four American towns.

To find out more about the show, go to this link!

http://www.pbs.org/thewar/ Cool
      
rasmussen81
DoW Content Provider
Designer's Oath

User Pages
Posts: 7191
Registered:
July 2007
Re:Ken Burns - The War Mon, 24 September 2007 15:46
"The War" is on every night this week (except maybe Thursday) so check your local listings and try to watch it! My wife and I recorded it on DVD last night and I think we'll end up with the whole thing by the end.

It's a seven part series that lasts over 14 hours all told. Enjoy! Very Happy
      
trumpetman52
Senior Member

User Pages
Posts: 254
Registered:
April 2006
Re:Ken Burns - The War Mon, 24 September 2007 20:11
Rasmussen81,
thanks for the notification. i missed the one yesterday but I will either record the rest of the series on DVD or VHS and place it on DVD. Thanks again for the Notification. I am running into a little time constraints, as I am volunteering for the Gathering of Mustangs and legends at Rickenbacker AFB this week, but I will get them.
THX

trumpetman52
      
beagleblue2
Member

User Pages
Posts: 44
Registered:
August 2007
Re:Ken Burns - The War Fri, 28 September 2007 10:07
I have to quote a friend of mine from what I have seen so far . . .

"Ignore Ken Burn's 'The WAR'. He's a commie and spends more
time on Japanese internment and black segregation than on Midway and Guadalcanal. Pissant!"

Can't improve much on these sentiments . . .

But I am still watching . . .
      
rasmussen81
DoW Content Provider
Designer's Oath

User Pages
Posts: 7191
Registered:
July 2007
Re:Ken Burns - The War Fri, 28 September 2007 16:02
beagleblue2 wrote on Fri, 28 September 2007 01:07

I have to quote a friend of mine from what I have seen so far . . .

"Ignore Ken Burn's 'The WAR'. He's a commie and spends more
time on Japanese internment and black segregation than on Midway and Guadalcanal. Pissant!"

Can't improve much on these sentiments . . .

But I am still watching . . .


You have to be kidding me! Are you trying to say that any one part of that was is that much less important or significant than another part!? People suffered through the war in so many ways that no one show could ever cover it all. If you want to see fighting, watch a documentary or movie about those battles, but to call Ken Burns a commie is ridiculous!! Evil or Very Mad
      
colinkun
Junior Member
Cadet

User Pages
Posts: 12
Registered:
August 2005
Re:Ken Burns - The War Fri, 28 September 2007 20:41
Ken Burns does great work, no question about it. And while you might not love the fact that this documentary spends a lot of time focusing on the war at home, it certainly was a big part. There are plenty of other films that focus on the battles and the gun shots, and so Burns should be applauded for turning some attention on other aspects of the era.

I think the communist is the one who wants to censor the info and doesn't want people to know about sensitive subjects like japanese internment.
      
50th
Senior Member
Armor Specialist

User Pages
Posts: 1417
Registered:
October 2006
Re:Ken Burns - The War Tue, 02 October 2007 03:54
beagleblue2 wrote on Fri, 28 September 2007 03:07

I have to quote a friend of mine from what I have seen so far . . .

"Ignore Ken Burn's 'The WAR'. He's a commie and spends more
time on Japanese internment and black segregation than on Midway and Guadalcanal. Pissant!"

Can't improve much on these sentiments . . .

But I am still watching . . .


Yeah, I think they have it on now for political reasons. To show people how bad war is and that we don't want to vote for any of those "warmonger" republicans. God forbid that we vote for the "warmongers"

Yeah, I am watching it and this is what I get out of it.
      
Roobarb
Senior Member

User Pages
Posts: 1004
Registered:
May 2007
Re:Ken Burns - The War Tue, 02 October 2007 04:53
No Message Body

[Updated on: Tue, 02 October 2007 07:43]

      
Macht Schnell
Junior Member

Posts: 10
Registered:
August 2004
Re:Ken Burns - The War Tue, 02 October 2007 22:20
50th wrote on Mon, 01 October 2007 20:54

beagleblue2 wrote on Fri, 28 September 2007 03:07

I have to quote a friend of mine from what I have seen so far . . .

"Ignore Ken Burn's 'The WAR'. He's a commie and spends more
time on Japanese internment and black segregation than on Midway and Guadalcanal. Pissant!"

Can't improve much on these sentiments . . .

But I am still watching . . .


Yeah, I think they have it on now for political reasons. To show people how bad war is and that we don't want to vote for any of those "warmonger" republicans. God forbid that we vote for the "warmongers"

Yeah, I am watching it and this is what I get out of it.



I would hate for this thread to become political, but as a Conservative myself, I take offense to your comments.

I do not think any of this documentary has a message about our current situation in the Middle East. It tells the story about the war. It tells not just the story about the men and women who were overseas protecting our freedoms, but also about the people they left behind, who fought their own private wars at home.

To the original poster that I quoted, they also talked about the prisoner of war camps in Manila and also how the American troops were treated. What we did to the Japanese Americans by putting them in camps was bad, but at least we kept them fed and gave them medical care and didn't shoot them whenever we felt like it.

The issue with the black segregation is also a valid one. These African Americans wanted to protect our country just as bad as the other Americans. They made the same sacrifices, bled just like other Americans, and to be totally honest, performed with heroic gallantry wherever asked to serve. All this, and we treated them like third class citizens.

I'll close with a story that reflects my last point. I served in Germany with the US Army during the late 1980s. I had taken German in High School and in college so I could talk to a lot of the Germans that already did not know English. I met one gentleman that was impressed with my German and he told me how much he loved America. I asked him why and he told me how he was in the German Army and he was captured during the Normandy invasion. He told me how he was shipped to a POW camp in the United States. He said that he was treated better than his own Army treated him. He was allowed to roam around pretty freely and that he was allowed to drive a truck a few times. The next statement really got me, though. He said that he was even treated better than the black people in the area that he was held at. A German POW and he is treated better than an American just because of his skin color. I don't care if you are a Republican or a Democrat. It is a disgraceful part of our past.
      
colinkun
Junior Member
Cadet

User Pages
Posts: 12
Registered:
August 2005
Re:Ken Burns - The War Tue, 02 October 2007 22:42
"One of the great ironies of World War II was that we were fighting the world's biggest racist (Hitler), yet we treated German POW's better than blacks in our own ranks."
-Paul Fussell in "A Boy's Crusade"
      
Whiterook
Senior Member

Posts: 296
Registered:
December 2006
Re:Ken Burns - The War Wed, 03 October 2007 01:26
I too think it is a rediculous statement against Ken Burns. "The War" is about people; how the war effected people. Mr. Burns isn't out to produce an accounting of military history from the vantage taken by a lot of what is already shown out there, such as on the History Channel and the Military Channel...and I watch a LOT of that stuff, as I am a huge WWII buff. Anyone who has seen even a little of Ken Burn's other works, can naturally expect to see the given subject from the human perspective, not necessarily a historian's or tactician's perspective.

In example: I was absolutely blown a-fricken-way by the segment of that incredible native American veteran relating how his actions in one engagement satisfied his peoples 4 requirements for becoming a War Chief, of which was totally coincidental to him, as he was just doing his duty! That's AMAZING stuff!! That generation didn't talk about the war...period. My dad served in the Canadian Army, from Normandy to Berlin, and he didn't talk about it. Period. What a rare glimpse of history we are getting, mostly from the Citizen Soldier's perspective. That one segment alone was worth watching and will stick with me for a very long time. And believe me, there were a lot of other "Wow" moments shown thus far. It may not be everyone's cup of tea, but hey, turn the channel to the Simpsons for your cerebral gratification if you object so strongly.

I have no desire to get in a philosophical diatribe here either, but the commie-calling "friend" of BeagleBlue needs to get his head out of his sphincter.
      
50th
Senior Member
Armor Specialist

User Pages
Posts: 1417
Registered:
October 2006
Re:Ken Burns - The War Wed, 03 October 2007 02:25
I've been watching the series. I am also interested in the second world war and currently have 13 WWII movies and Victory at Sea, and Crusade in the Pacific Documentaries. I'm sorry to get political, but I am political. I just question the timing of this series. Enough about politics. I just wanted to share my opinion about it, and see if anyone else felt the same way. Didn't mean to ruffle feathers.
      
Whiterook
Senior Member

Posts: 296
Registered:
December 2006
Re:Ken Burns - The War Wed, 03 October 2007 18:46
Yeah, I know what you mean, 50th....my response probably sounded a little more "hot tempered" than I like to get. These days, with the political world on such a sharp edge, it's hard to tell what motives are behind a lot of stuff going on, I will certainly agree with that. What frosted my cupcakes, honestly, is the very point that we're losing a generation, every day, that participated in literally Earth shattering events that changed the world; and for whatever motive behind it, we have their story being portrayed to millions on television and DVD. A lot of kids just aren't learning a lot of this stuff today, so I'm willing to cut Burn's motives some slack in order to put a face on the history books. To discount the benefits of this broadcast is not prudent. I guess we have to choose our battles.

No hard feelings....just my two cents.
      
Roobarb
Senior Member

User Pages
Posts: 1004
Registered:
May 2007
Re:Ken Burns - The War Thu, 04 October 2007 11:39
No Message Body

[Updated on: Thu, 04 October 2007 11:39]

      
neil1967
Member
Oberst

User Pages
Posts: 64
Registered:
November 2006
Re:Ken Burns - The War Thu, 04 October 2007 15:33
I haven't seen the program concerned (is it available in the UK?), but if the original post in the thread is correct then the focus of the program is "the war and it's impact on the people of four American towns", so I'd expect it to be more about "the home front" than about the battles.

Regarding treatment of German POW's, the ones sent to the US were fairly well off, the ones held in Germany after the war were kept in atrotious conditions (but then, they were being held by armies that had liberated concentration camps, so it's understandable). Estimates of German soldiers who died in western captivity vary widely, from several thousand to over a million. I tend to believe the lower estimates, for what it's worth. German POW's in the Soviet Union were far worse off, but that's fairly common knowledge.

Regarding the Japanese, I'll offer the following quote:

"During World War II, Allied (particularly American) troops regularly collected the skulls of dead Japanese as personal trophies, as souvenirs for friends and family at home, and for sale to others. (The practice was unique to the Pacific theater; German and Italian skulls were not taken.) The Commander in Chief of the Pacific Fleet, in September of 1942, mandated strong disciplinary action for any soldier who took enemy body parts as souvenirs. Nevertheless, trophy-hunting persisted: Life, in its issue of 22 May 1944, published a photograph of a young woman posing with the autographed skull sent to her by her Navy boyfriend, causing significant public outcry."

Given that collecting enemy bodyparts was a feature of both the original American occupation of the Philipines and the Vietnam war there seems to be a rather nasty trend here...

Make of that what you will, I've probably said enough already to be branded a hardline communist or whatever... Rolling Eyes
      
Roobarb
Senior Member

User Pages
Posts: 1004
Registered:
May 2007
Re:Ken Burns - The War Thu, 04 October 2007 16:14
hay neil just tell em you are a communist and they will ignore you and then you can say what you like Mad
      
neil1967
Member
Oberst

User Pages
Posts: 64
Registered:
November 2006
Re:Ken Burns - The War Thu, 04 October 2007 18:51
Quote:

hay neil just tell em you are a communist and they will ignore you and then you can say what you like


Now there's a thought... Laughing

      
beagleblue2
Member

User Pages
Posts: 44
Registered:
August 2007
Re:Ken Burns - The War Fri, 05 October 2007 06:54
Well at least posting my friend's comments stirred up some posts . . .

I have to comment on the bit about trophies being taken in the Pacific. It was common knowledge after the first landings in the island-hopping campaign that any allied soldier taken prisoner was likely to be tortured, murdered and mutilated. It happened time and again. The result was an equally apalling retaliatory abuse of Japanese remains, though few Japanese prisoners faced execution, torture and such from their American captors, though I have no doubt there were isolated incidents.

I had the opportunity to discuss how the war was viewed by the Japanese with a former Japanese ambassador to the US some years ago. Hold on to your hats, cause I'm about to paraphrase his remarks and you won't believe it.

He claimed that were it not for Japanese expansion into S.E. Asia, those poor peoples might still be living under Western colonial tyranny even today, so the people of Korea, Vietnam and others owe Japan a debt of gratitude for helping them throw of the yoke of Western Imperialism.

When I pointed out that the same sort of logic could be applied to Germany, i.e., Israel would not exist were it not for the holocaust and therefore the Israelis should have a holiday in honor of Hitler--well, that ended the conversation. He seemed quite offended by the comparison, but I had been equally appalled at his characterization of colonial governments like our own in the Phillipines.

The point is that even though we now enjoy excellent relations with our old enemy, that does not mean that we interpret our common history in the same way. Not even close.

And, while I did enjoy much of the Ken Burns documentary, I was not blind to some rather obvious propaganda, both in terms of the choices Burns made about what to emphasize and what would be ignored or glossed over . . .

      
Roobarb
Senior Member

User Pages
Posts: 1004
Registered:
May 2007
Re:Ken Burns - The War Fri, 05 October 2007 09:24
war is the absense of sanity of logic it is humanity at its most base at its worst i consider my self as an open minded person and if i founed self stuck in a war fighting in one of those campains i have to admit to my self that any enemy who whould surender to me whould be lucky to live ie if he presented a target id shoot it so i dont judge soldegers who do things that are out of order

i did not see this documentry as im in the UK maybe it was properganda but maybe he was just high lighting the parts of WW2 that are glossed over by other documenteys

talking about propeganda i find it rich that this charge is being cryed by republicans when the leaders of this party ie the neo cons have blantly lied over and over again
Frown
not that my own goverment has not tryed to lie to me
Mad


[Updated on: Fri, 05 October 2007 11:04]

      
neil1967
Member
Oberst

User Pages
Posts: 64
Registered:
November 2006
Re:Ken Burns - The War Fri, 05 October 2007 11:41
Quote:

talking about propeganda i find it rich that this charge is being cryed by republicans when the leaders of this party ie the neo cons have blantly lied over and over again

not that my own goverment has not tryed to lie to me




Probably best to avoid discussing current political issues on this site (I'd have thought), no matter how much I may agree with you.

I don't know the site policy, but I'd imagine we should only be talking about games or subjects relating to WWII history (be it actual history, films, TV programs, whatever).

I enjoy discussing modern politics, I just don't think this is the place for it.
      
Roobarb
Senior Member

User Pages
Posts: 1004
Registered:
May 2007
Re:Ken Burns - The War Fri, 05 October 2007 12:31
your right im sorry Embarassed
      
    
Previous Topic:Kamikaze, Recon & Rescue...
Next Topic:Which should I buy next?
Goto Forum: