Five Tribes Five Tribes

Forums

Search
Forums » Memoir '44 - English » politicla commissars?
Show: Today's Posts 
  
AuthorTopic
guest506182
Junior Member

Posts: 2
Registered:
January 2009
  politicla commissars? Thu, 01 January 2009 19:51
what good are the political commissars? any benefits? or just crap?
      
sam1812
Senior Member
Brigadier General

User Pages
Posts: 2245
Registered:
August 2006
Re:politicla commissars? Thu, 01 January 2009 20:21
Hi, and welcome to the Forum --

Some of the various nationalities have special rules in certain scenarios. It reflects something about the character of their armies. It affects the strategy and keeps the game from seeming the same all the time.

In some cases, it's a clear advantage -- for example, US Marines in the Pacific expansion get to order an extra unit. In other cases, it's a mixed blessing -- such as the French Resistance, who have some movement advantages but start with only 3 figures.

In the case of the Russian Commissar rule, which is intended to reflect inefficiencies in the Soviet command structure, it makes things more difficult for the player: He has to choose his card one turn in advance. Despite this handicap, the dug-in Russian player tends to win in several of the battles.

What good are they? They make a great scapegoat if the Russian player loses. Smile
      
rasmussen81
DoW Content Provider
Designer's Oath

User Pages
Posts: 7072
Registered:
July 2007
Re:politicla commissars? Thu, 01 January 2009 20:35
guest506182 wrote on Thu, 01 January 2009 10:51

what good are the political commissars? any benefits? or just crap?


Interesting attitude there...are you actually looking for a response (which Sam did a good job giving you) or is your mind already made up that it's "just crap"? Rolling Eyes

Personally, it's hard to want to answer comments like this. Confused

[Updated on: Thu, 01 January 2009 21:03]

      
guest506182
Junior Member

Posts: 2
Registered:
January 2009
Re:politicla commissars? Thu, 01 January 2009 21:18
thanks sam, i am new and always looking for good advice
      
Zasdert Ultun
Senior Member
First Lieutenant

User Pages
Posts: 334
Registered:
March 2007
Re:politicla commissars? Thu, 01 January 2009 21:59
the other thing is, its required, not optional. So, no there are really no benefits (besides being a scapegoat), but it is trying to mimic the way things actually were. Also, the battles are playtested under these rules, so taking them away might upset the balance.
      
sam1812
Senior Member
Brigadier General

User Pages
Posts: 2245
Registered:
August 2006
Re:politicla commissars? Thu, 01 January 2009 22:40
No problem, Guest. In any game, there's bound to be something puzzling or irritating at first. (In Monopoly, I find it to be the Income Tax square.) Personally, I find the the best revenge is to win with it.

By the way -- two other points:

1. While the scenarios say the commissar rule is used, the book has no way to enforce that upon players in the privacy of their own homes. If you're not comfortable with the chip and decide not to use it, it won't object.

2. While Memoir is a game with a profound respect for history and the various special national rules are intended to reflect certain historical aspects of those countries' forces, you're free to treat it as a more abstract game and use the special rules in a more utilitarian way. For example, you could (theoretically) use the commissar chip as a handicap for a stronger player in any scenario.
      
Achtung Panzer
Senior Member
Leutnant

User Pages
Posts: 1063
Registered:
December 2007
Re:politicla commissars? Thu, 01 January 2009 22:56
rasmussen81 wrote on Thu, 01 January 2009 19:35

guest506182 wrote on Thu, 01 January 2009 10:51

what good are the political commissars? any benefits? or just crap?


Personally, it's hard to want to answer comments like this. Confused


I'm with you all the way on this rasmussen81!

      
Katipunero
Junior Member
Cadet

Posts: 8
Registered:
March 2010
Re:politicla commissars? Thu, 25 March 2010 11:54
I understand the nature of this Russian structure of command which was employed during that time, and I'd like to utilize this when I play the Russian scenarios, but I'm still confuse with the rules.

I understand about having to pick a Command card and putting under the Commissar Chip which will be used in the next turn, what I'm confused with is the following:

"in lieu of playing the Command Card already committed under the Commissar Chip, the Russian player may choose to play from his hand a Recon 1 Command Card or a Counter-Attack Command Card... The Russian player may also play the Ambush Card from his hand per the standard rule."

Doesn't this contradict the rule of playing the card committed under the Commissar Chip since a player may choose to play a different card?

      
stevens
Senior Member
Memoir '44 Online Betatester

User Pages
Posts: 3013
Registered:
February 2007
Re:politicla commissars? Thu, 25 March 2010 12:24
It adds a little reality to the game, since Political Commissar or not, no unit would just sit there and be attacked and not respond if they had opportunity. Only two cards are actually able to be played on the Russians turn:

RECON-1
COUNTER-ATTACK

The AMBUSH is played on the Axis turn in response to close a assault attack.

So the majority of the time it takes some deft planning and good defense to play the Russians.If you look at the AARs you will see that despite this limitation, the Russians still manage to squeak out more victories or get better odds than might be expected.
      
ad79
Senior Member
Major Howard

User Pages
Posts: 786
Registered:
September 2007
Re:politicla commissars? Thu, 25 March 2010 20:26
I find the Commisar rule very good. Makes me think alot more during my games.

THis is how I have thought about why you can play Recon 1 and Counter-attack from the hand.

Recon 1: This is the limit to what kind of reaction the Russian command structure at that time could come up with in a short time in response to enemy activity in another section than the Commisar had planned.

Counter-attack: Desperation within the troops being attacked by the enemy, have them ignore the Commisar and just launch an all out fight for their lives without thinking about the consequences. The Commisar then regaining control of his troops and ordering the order that was planned is reflected in the planned card under the chip being played the next turn.

That is my thoughts about those cards.

Stig Morten
      
Antoi
Senior Member
Bring Boys Back Home

User Pages
Posts: 627
Registered:
March 2005
Re:politicla commissars? Thu, 25 March 2010 21:30
As long as the russian player has the initiative (is that correct English??) there would be no problem because the German player has to response to your cards Smile

There is of course a little problem when the German player controls the game, than you need all the advice the other members give you Very Happy (which of course you should always keep in mind Razz )
      
marnick
Member
Lucky Bastard

User Pages
Posts: 79
Registered:
December 2009
Re:politicla commissars? Thu, 01 April 2010 17:35
What I find most annoying about commissars is that you have a hand size that is one smaller de facto. For example, you have 5 card hand size. One is under the chip. That means you actually have 4 cards to choose your next move from, you one of those four under the chip, play the card already under it and only draw a new one at the end of you turn.

You're always one card short. This is, imho, the biggest limitation to the commissar. Having to preplan your tactics is no big deal usually. The game is rather static and in 1 turn not much changes usually. The exception is medics and mechanics, which benefits most from proper timing.
      
Achtung Panzer
Senior Member
Leutnant

User Pages
Posts: 1063
Registered:
December 2007
Re:politicla commissars? Fri, 02 April 2010 11:10
marnick wrote on Thu, 01 April 2010 16:35

What I find most annoying about commissars is that you have a hand size that is one smaller de facto. For example, you have 5 card hand size. One is under the chip. That means you actually have 4 cards to choose your next move from, you one of those four under the chip, play the card already under it and only draw a new one at the end of you turn.

You're always one card short. This is, imho, the biggest limitation to the commissar.


That's the point. Commissars were a political check / brake on orders being issued, which made the Soviet forces tactically less flexible and efficient. This gives paying the Soviets the correct historical flavour, but you can still win!

Of course you could always play scenarios after spring 1943 when the Commissar rule is no longer in play - the Soviets were then far better organised.
      
    
Previous Topic:Scenario Odds / Balanced Scenarios
Next Topic:Organized play kit in Europe?
Goto Forum: