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Dasher
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More Combat Cards, Please! Tue, 29 March 2011 20:37
I gotta say, I really love the "Combat Cards" for Urban and Winter environments.

Can we hope for a set for Desert and Jungle as well?

And one "generic" for the special events that occur on the basic Open and Beachhead battlefields?

Yeah, I know, I want the Moon...

Oooooh yeah... Combat cards for battles ON THE MOON!!! Very Happy
      
Nordiskanc
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Tue, 29 March 2011 22:03
I would also like to see the desert and jungle combat cards. Maybe the desert cards in the Italian Army pack and the jungle cards in the Battle Map Series 2. Rolling Eyes Heres to hoping.
      
50th
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Tue, 29 March 2011 22:36
I would like to see Pacific Theater Combat cards, as this is my favorite theater. They might make some of my Pacific scenarios more interesting.

      
ClanNatioy
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Wed, 30 March 2011 01:40
I too want to see more combat card types. I'm hoping they do a desert warfare one next.

Maybe they could also do combat cards for the different nations. Each nation having their own deck of 20 cards that reflects that nations tactics.

      
OldBloodandGuts
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Wed, 30 March 2011 03:46
50th wrote on Tue, 29 March 2011 16:36

I would like to see Pacific Theater Combat cards, as this is my favorite theater. They might make some of my Pacific scenarios more interesting.





It would be cool to add some flavor to Pacific scenarios, but what makes Pacific cards so tricky is the wide range of climates and fighting environments. The early war jungle fighting of the Philippines and Guadalcanal, for example, is a lot different than the scorched earth cave-fighting on Iwo Jima and Okinawa.

What I'd like to see -- and what would cover many environments of the late-war Pacific -- is a Monte Cassino Expansion. This would include Italian pieces (we can argue over what the soldier/rifle, armor, and artillery models should be) and a special deck for "Mountain Combat" -- equally applicable in Southern Europe as it was at Iwo or Okinawa.

I know it's a bit of a stretch to call it a Monte Cassino Expansion and include Italian toys, since it was mostly Germans fighting at Cassino, but I bet M44 players would be willing to suspend disbelief...
      
rasmussen81
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Wed, 30 March 2011 07:32
Hmmm, a Mountain Combat Card deck! That would be very cool... Smile

I really like the addition of the Combat Cards and I hope we see lots more of them!!
      
ggleize
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Wed, 30 March 2011 12:24
Am I the only one not to like the combat cards?
Well ...
I love the simplicity of M44 and left Battlelore because of all thoses side effect and action to apply and explain to my (usually not gameboardgeek) players!

Please M44 don't make the same error: specials cards ... more special rules to buy ... more special cards to buy ... more special rules to lurn etc etc etc ... Then goodbye again the normal players and back again to a micro universe of "good-students-glasses-wargamegeeks"!

Ho no! Not again!

Please: stay pure and basic!

GG
      
Paletti
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Wed, 30 March 2011 13:24
ggleize wrote on Wed, 30 March 2011 12:24

Then goodbye again the normal players and back again to a micro universe of "good-students-glasses-wargamegeeks"!
GG


I also like to see new combat cards. I consider myself and my gaming-friends 'normal players', but I wouldn't say goodbye to Memoir with the introduction of new expansions (incl. combat cards). In contrary, we're looking forward to new expansions for Memoir. And the suggestions of desert/jungle/mountain combat cards sound great!!
      
rasmussen81
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Wed, 30 March 2011 15:46
ggleize wrote on Wed, 30 March 2011 14:24

Please: stay pure and basic!

GG


There are some very simple things you can do to make sure this is true for you and your friends...just play with the expansions you like!! And add in the more complicated expansions slowly as people learn the rules.

If you don't want more complicated expansions, what would you like to see as the next expansion? Smile
      
Erik Uitdebroeck
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Wed, 30 March 2011 15:56
One does not have to play with the expansions.
I am convinced that you can have a lot of fun with only the bas game.
And there are plenty (hundreds) of scenario's for the base game only.
You can make M44 as complicated as you wish.
Or you can keep it as simple as you wish.
And another thing :
Sure DoW want to make money. Everybody does, me included. But IMHO : M44 does not have to be expensive. The base-game on itself is a perfect game.
      
boersma8
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Wed, 30 March 2011 16:27
Nobody forces anyone to play with any of the add-ons as was justly mentioned.

I'd also like to see more combat cards: desert, jungle and also MORE winter combat cards specifically designed for the sub-zero Eastern front conditions. Some examples I like best myself:

Frostbite: Roll a die against each enemy infantry unit (possibly limited to a section). On a grenade lose one figure. Obviously this one should be used sparingly (i.e. removed from the deck in certain cases) as it can potentially be a very powerful card.It is historically accurate, however, as the Germans lost more men and material due to the weather conditions than as a direct effect of combat actions in the Moscow counter-offensive of 1941.Something similar could be done for vehicles and artillery units (frozen vehicle parts).

Heavy snowfall: LOS is limited to just one hex.

Snowstorm: No actions allowed. Play this card after your opponent has selected a card from his hand to play.In addition you're required to lay aside a (NORMAL) card of your own. Immediately draw another one, but it's again your opponents turn.

Stuck in the snow: Select one enemy unit just ordered (but before it actually does anything). It may not move or fire this turn.
      
PlanBee
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Wed, 30 March 2011 17:51
ggleize wrote on Wed, 30 March 2011 11:24

Am I the only one not to like the combat cards?
Well ...
I love the simplicity of M44 and left Battlelore because of all thoses side effect and action to apply and explain to my (usually not gameboardgeek) players!

Please M44 don't make the same error: specials cards ... more special rules to buy ... more special cards to buy ... more special rules to lurn etc etc etc ... Then goodbye again the normal players and back again to a micro universe of "good-students-glasses-wargamegeeks"!

Ho no! Not again!

Please: stay pure and basic!

GG


I have both sets of combat cards and I am not especially keen on them. Dont think its adds enough to the strategic decision making to justify the extra complexity.

And yes I know I dont have to buy the expansions etc etc, but like GG I am just expressing an opinion.
      
50th
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Wed, 30 March 2011 19:09
boersma8 wrote on Wed, 30 March 2011 09:27


Heavy snowfall: LOS is limited to just one hex.

Snowstorm: No actions allowed. Play this card after your opponent has selected a card from his hand to play.In addition you're required to lay aside a (NORMAL) card of your own. Immediately draw another one, but it's again your opponents turn.

Stuck in the snow: Select one enemy unit just ordered (but before it actually does anything). It may not move or fire this turn.


I don't use the reduced visibility rules of WW, I use Rasmussen81's weather rules (available on his user project page) as with these rules, weather can get worse or better. In the last game I played with these rules, visibility never got above three hexes, then fell back down to one. This added a lot of realism to my "The Bulge Pushes Out" scenario. I won as Germans because the Allies artillery was severely hampered by visibility.

      
boersma8
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Wed, 30 March 2011 22:16
Maybe it's just me, but honestly speaking I don't think there's anything 'complex" about the combat cards. They're all rather straightforward. the only thing remotely complex about the game is the aircraft rules. It's the only thing I usually have to look up again after a break from playing memoir '44.
      
AIwan
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Thu, 31 March 2011 09:21
My idea is to introduce deck of cards with constant/lasting effects.

For example a card which allows you to ignore first flag when adjacent to two friendly units (formations) or gives extra dice when firing out of the forest or town hex, or gives you ability to fire without LOS if you control a nearby mountain or gives you machine gun if you capture a town hex in the next turn etc

This cards could be shuffled into the main deck or used as a separate deck (like combat cards).

For example there could be a regular probe card which at the bottom would have an extra constant text (e.g. superior formation). If you decide to use it, it will be placed near the board. The next time you draw card with constant text you can either replace the old one or simply do not use the extra text on the new one. (so there is max. one effect per side at the same momoent)

With balanced and interesting cards I think it might add extra flavor to the strategic decision making.
      
ggleize
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Fri, 01 April 2011 13:19
First at all sorry for my poor english.

Thank all for your clever answers: I mean my post could have make people react aggressively (as usual in most of the forums by thoses days) ... but you all stayed cool: You deserve to be officers!

OK about the cards: I understand they are pleasant to play. But (how to explain ...) I'm myself a game creator from a very long time. I just refused to even watch more than 3 of thoses cards because I SAW IT WAS GREAT BUT I REFUSED TO COMPLEXIFY THE MECCANISM OF THIS BEAUTIFULL GAME!

WAIT: I bought Winters Wars and loved most of the new rules. But as said some peoples on that subject: I CHOOSED WICH NEW RULE I WILL USE OR NOT!

Someone said for exemple not using the "reduced visibility": Hey Kamarad, same for me: I don't use it neither!

But in the other hand I really love and use the NEW UNITS like SPECIAL GUNS, MORTARS, MACHINEGUNS, ANTITANKS, TANK DESTROYERS etc !!!

So my philosophy could be written:
NEW UNITS, LANDS AND SCENARIOS: YES!
NEW RULES & GAME MECCANISM: NO!


For example: I just ordered the new 150 years edition of BATTLECRY (long time for Europe) ... YOU KNOW WHY?
TO GO BACK TO A PURE & SIMPLE GAME
which makes you only concentrate on the strategy and not on the special rules!

The characteristic of most of the best "brain games" in this
world is often the simplicity of their base rules!

Arf ... not sure to had been clear ... lol!

Rolling Eyes


      
stevens
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Fri, 01 April 2011 13:29
Yes, I understand you brother. Simple is better from your perspective.

The great thing about Memoir '44 is that you have a CHOICE.

You can stay with the basic game, but you are free to add expansions, board sizes, special units and rules, etc.

I love the variety and the ability to take the simple rules and expand upon them. Keep playing and keep having fun!
      
Mighty Jim 83
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Fri, 01 April 2011 18:14
Also, from DoW perspective, if they want to sell us more expansions (and there's enough of us clamouring to buy them), then they have to complexify things. There are so many scenarios from the front out there, that just a book of new scenarios probably wouldn't sell that well- new rules/cards/minis are the things that keep business ticking over, and broadly speaking, they have to target it at people who have already bought quite a bit of memoir stuff and have nothing else left to buy, rather than at people with plenty of options left to them.
      
nemesszili
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Fri, 01 April 2011 19:33
If new scenarios (especially new campaigns) are really interesting, then they may be sold as good as new minis...
      
Achtung Panzer
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Tue, 05 April 2011 11:30
boersma8 wrote on Wed, 30 March 2011 21:16

The only thing remotely complex about the game is the aircraft rules. It's the only thing I usually have to look up again after a break from playing memoir '44.


Glad it's not just me then! Laughing

      
ggleize
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Tue, 05 April 2011 12:58
The old debate is still what do you feel "complex" or not (so playable or not)? To play the national lotery? M44? M44 Extentions? C&C Napoleonics? Pure 10 hours Wargame? Bridge? Chess? ...

Everyone has its opinion about "complex" or not!

Mine is that the initial success of M44 was based on the basique M44 rules SIMPLICITY.

And that with each new extention, if it's true that you offer a new pleasure to some players, each time you add un number of rules and meccanisms, so fewer and fewer are the players following it!

I understand the buisness has to go on as long as enough players are happy ... making also the buisness positive and the game conceptors happy too!

Exemple with me: I bought quite everything around M44 but with each extentions there were more and more rules that I refused and marked "NO" on the rulebook with my pencil! Until I definitively refused some extentions like the "Air Pack" and the "Pacific" ones! ... But I admit I cracked later for the "Winter Wars" because of some very interesting new units and scenarios ... but still refused for example the "Lack of Visibility" (slowing down the game & going boring) and the "Combat Cards" (don't want to go back to the default of "Battlelore", wich I sold back, with too many materials, cards & meccanisms).

PURE GAME PLEASE! PURE GAME!

In fact I'm sorry but I work in the poker buisness (not directly as player) and I'm used so much with the simplicity of its material (chips & cards) for a maximum of sensations (so the odds material/sensations is +) that I will never ever support any game getting more or more materials and meccanisms!

Once again: I respect everyone'pleasure and vision of the entensions of M44 but I would like THE CONCEPTORS not to forget the reasons of their initial SUCCESS!

Cool

[Updated on: Tue, 05 April 2011 13:05]

      
boersma8
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Tue, 05 April 2011 15:05
ggleize wrote on Tue, 05 April 2011 12:58

The old debate is still what do you feel "complex" or not (so playable or not)? To play the national lotery? M44? M44 Extentions? C&C Napoleonics? Pure 10 hours Wargame? Bridge? Chess? ...

Everyone has its opinion about "complex" or not!

Mine is that the initial success of M44 was based on the basique M44 rules SIMPLICITY.

And that with each new extention, if it's true that you offer a new pleasure to some players, each time you add un number of rules and meccanisms, so fewer and fewer are the players following it!

I understand the buisness has to go on as long as enough players are happy ... making also the buisness positive and the game conceptors happy too!

Exemple with me: I bought quite everything around M44 but with each extentions there were more and more rules that I refused and marked "NO" on the rulebook with my pencil! Until I definitively refused some extentions like the "Air Pack" and the "Pacific" ones! ... But I admit I cracked later for the "Winter Wars" because of some very interesting new units and scenarios ... but still refused for example the "Lack of Visibility" (slowing down the game & going boring) and the "Combat Cards" (don't want to go back to the default of "Battlelore", wich I sold back, with too many materials, cards & meccanisms).

PURE GAME PLEASE! PURE GAME!

In fact I'm sorry but I work in the poker buisness (not directly as player) and I'm used so much with the simplicity of its material (chips & cards) for a maximum of sensations (so the odds material/sensations is +) that I will never ever support any game getting more or more materials and meccanisms!

Once again: I respect everyone'pleasure and vision of the entensions of M44 but I would like THE CONCEPTORS not to forget the reasons of their initial SUCCESS!

Cool


Well, as i see it, you hit the nail on the head meaning that frankly, I don't see any problem. You said "no" to certain added rules (Pacific, air pack, limited visibility), whereas others will embrace them. The game is fine in both cases. What's more certain scenarios use the air rules, others do not. The same is true for the "cave rules" in the Pacific expansion and the limited visibility rules in the winter expansion. I'm hoping that those scenarios WERE playtested with the rules in question in effect, so simply not using them might at times throw the scenario off balance, but as i said: all expansions include scenarios in which certain new units, new rules and new terrain aren't used: great news for all players; those that want more complexity and those that don't!
      
JJs Juggernaut
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Fri, 08 April 2011 00:51
I wish you could just buy the combat cards seperatly. I don't have the funds to by the expantionsa yet Sad , but I will get them eventualy. I'm considering getting the Winter Wars expansion next when I can. I own the base game, Terrain pack, Estern Front, and the Breakthrough map. Any suggestions as to if this is a good idea or should I buy some other expansions first.
      
rasmussen81
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Fri, 08 April 2011 04:50
JJs Juggernaut wrote on Fri, 08 April 2011 02:51

I'm considering getting the Winter Wars expansion next when I can. I own the base game, Terrain pack, Estern Front, and the Breakthrough map. Any suggestions as to if this is a good idea or should I buy some other expansions first.


That would be a fine plan. The Winter Wars expansion will fit nicely with the ones you already own...and it will provide you with some great new winter scenarios! Also, you'll get one of the Combat Decks!! Smile

To reduce the cost a little, you might think about registering a few game codes from DoW big games like the Memoir '44 base game, Ticket to Ride, Small World, etc to get the 10% discount they provide. Then you could get up to 20% discount for Winter Wars! Or if you bought a Major Pack for Memoir '44 Online you could use the $30 coupon to help reduce your price of the Winter Wars expansion...

Of course you might not have any of the options I mentioned above, but it will help you if you do!! Very Happy
      
ad79
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Fri, 08 April 2011 08:51
JJs Juggernaut wrote on Fri, 08 April 2011 00:51

I wish you could just buy the combat cards seperatly. I don't have the funds to by the expantionsa yet Sad , but I will get them eventualy. I'm considering getting the Winter Wars expansion next when I can. I own the base game, Terrain pack, Estern Front, and the Breakthrough map. Any suggestions as to if this is a good idea or should I buy some other expansions first.


Winter Wars sounds like a solid plan.

My opinion: It has some excellent scenarios and the added stuff(units, tiles, rules and cards)is fun stuff.
      
Maimed1
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Re:More Combat Cards, Please! Fri, 08 April 2011 17:59
ad79 schrieb am Fri, 08 April 2011 08:51

JJs Juggernaut wrote on Fri, 08 April 2011 00:51

I wish you could just buy the combat cards seperatly. I don't have the funds to by the expantionsa yet Sad , but I will get them eventualy. I'm considering getting the Winter Wars expansion next when I can. I own the base game, Terrain pack, Estern Front, and the Breakthrough map. Any suggestions as to if this is a good idea or should I buy some other expansions first.


Winter Wars sounds like a solid plan.

My opinion: It has some excellent scenarios and the added stuff(units, tiles, rules and cards)is fun stuff.

I have all the expansions... some suggested using the breakthru deck for normal games.... why woud that be good? what are the diffrent options please... thank you
      
    
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