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clexton27
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General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Fri, 15 February 2013 19:31
Besides the typical terrain one encounters in Memoir '44 that occasionally obstructs movement, there is also a the small group of terrain obstacles which are intentionally designed for that purpose. Let's talk a bit about the HEDGEHOGS.

http://www.thatcutesite.com/uploads/2009/09/smug_looking_hedgehog.jpg

Not the cute little animals that inhabit our woodlands, but those prickly man-made objects that inhabited many of the beaches and urban jungles in WWII.

 http://static.memoir44.com/lang/english/images/mm_compendium_terrain_5.jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Czech_hedgehog

These devices were originally designed to inhibit armor movement. And on the beaches of Normandy they not only did that, but they also provided cover for many of the infantrymen attempting to make their way ashore under heavy enemy fire on D-Day. Just play SWORD BEACH, JUNO BEACH, or FIRST ASSAULT WAVE and you will see both the advantages and disadvantages these particular devices provide.

In time the Allies not only overcame these obstacles, but with the help of Sgt. Culin US Army, they were to later use them to help breach the HEDGEROWS they encountered inland.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curtis_G._Culin

So here is my quiz question:
Besides the Regular Armor (3 fig) and Specialized Armor (4 fig) tank units you typically encounter in a game,
give one example of another distinct fighting unit that may not enter a hex with a hedgehog.
(And obviously trains, aircraft carriers and destroyers don't count - at least not for this quiz!).

[Updated on: Fri, 15 February 2013 19:37]

      
nemesszili
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Fri, 15 February 2013 19:49
Well, you forgot to mention artillery. Very Happy
      
clexton27
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Fri, 15 February 2013 21:25
nemesszili wrote on Fri, 15 February 2013 13:49

Well, you forgot to mention artillery. Very Happy


That is a very broad category, Be specific and mention a particular Memoir '44 Artillery type.

The quiz says "give one example of another distinct fighting unit that may not enter a hex with a hedgehog.

[Updated on: Fri, 15 February 2013 22:20]

      
nemesszili
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Fri, 15 February 2013 21:54
Standard Artillery?

[Updated on: Sun, 17 February 2013 20:55]

      
Quit2
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Fri, 15 February 2013 22:11
Long range patrol cars.

From the rulesheet of LRPC
A terrain that is identified in the rules as Impassable or Impassable to Armor & Artillery is also considered as impassable to Patrol Car units.

YOu asked to only mention one, so I'll stick to it for once.
      
clexton27
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Fri, 15 February 2013 22:22
STANDARD ARTILLERY.
Yes, a good answer and you were clever enough to find that answer on the HEDGEHOG card itself. Bravo!

And thanks Szili for giving the whole community a chance to play.
Very Happy

[Updated on: Mon, 18 February 2013 00:57]

      
clexton27
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Fri, 15 February 2013 22:23
Quit2 wrote on Fri, 15 February 2013 16:11

Long range patrol cars.

From the rulesheet of LRPC
A terrain that is identified in the rules as Impassable or Impassable to Armor & Artillery is also considered as impassable to Patrol Car units.

YOu asked to only mention one, so I'll stick to it for once.


Thanks Quit2 for restraining your urges. You are to be commended.
So LONG RANGE PATROL CARS is one.

[Updated on: Sat, 16 February 2013 01:19]

      
Antoi
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Fri, 15 February 2013 23:58
supply trucks Rolling Eyes
      
clexton27
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Sat, 16 February 2013 01:18
Antoi wrote on Fri, 15 February 2013 17:58

supply trucks Rolling Eyes


Correcto! Yes, the SUPPLY TRUCK

p. 2 Supply Truck Rules
Quote:

A terrain that is identified in the rules as Impassable or Impassable to
Armor & Artillery is also considered as impassable to Supply Truck units.

So since Armor and Artillery may not enter a HEDGEHOG, neither can a SUPPLY TRUCK.

[Updated on: Sat, 16 February 2013 01:20]

      
sam1812
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Sat, 16 February 2013 05:30
I would assume that a plane couldn't land on a hex with hedgehogs -- though it could fly over or strike as a Kamikaze.
      
sam1812
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Sat, 16 February 2013 05:31
I would assume that a plane can't land on a hedgehog -- though it could fly over one or strike as a Kamikaze.

(Whoops -- duplicate post -- combination of new laptop and poor connection.)

[Updated on: Sun, 17 February 2013 06:51]

      
rasmussen81
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Sat, 16 February 2013 06:00
sam1812 wrote on Sat, 16 February 2013 08:31

I would assume that a plane can't land on a hedgehog -- though it could fly over one or strike as a Kamikaze.


In the Official scenarios, there are no examples of Hedgehogs on Airfields...so this might make sense for a house rule if someone builds a scenario where that happens, but nothing official. Smile
      
clexton27
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Sat, 16 February 2013 12:11
Actually Sam, an airplane may enter a hex with a hedgehog if attacking (the underlying terrain does not affect it). Also if the hex is vacant, the airplane may end its turn on a hex with a hedgehog and have an air check of 1 die.
So the hedgehog does not normally limit the airplane movement.
I can see your point about landing on a hedgehog, but since no official scenarios currently encounter that situation, I cannot anticipate the ruling, and will have to pass on the airplane as an answer.
The good thing is the thinking about it. This is what my brain does all the time - what ifs - in that way I enjoy your thinking process and am encouraged to know that I am not the only one with an active imagination. Smile
      
sam1812
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Sun, 17 February 2013 07:00
stevens wrote on Sat, 16 February 2013 06:11

Actually Sam, an airplane may enter a hex with a hedgehog if attacking (the underlying terrain does not affect it). Also if the hex is vacant, the airplane may end its turn on a hex with a hedgehog and have an air check of 1 die.

Yes -- we're saying the same thing in different words.

In actuality, it probably would make little sense to design a scenario with hedgehogs on an air strip, unless (for example) one of the players was allowed to place some hedgehogs before the start of play.
      
Michael Von Älterman
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Sun, 17 February 2013 16:57
you forgotten the half track
      
clexton27
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Sun, 17 February 2013 18:57
Michael Von Älterman wrote on Sun, 17 February 2013 10:57

you forgotten the half track


Very good. Yes according to the rules of a HALF-TRACK:

Quote:

A terrain that is identified in the rules as Impassable or
Impassable to Armor & Artillery is also considered as impassable
to Half-Track units.


So since HEDGEHOGS limit entry to Armor and Artillery the HALF-TRACK may not enter.
      
Michael Von Älterman
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Mon, 18 February 2013 18:16
and what is the reward for the good answer Laughing Laughing Rolling Eyes
      
clexton27
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Mon, 18 February 2013 18:46
Michael Von Älterman wrote on Mon, 18 February 2013 12:16

and what is the reward for the good answer Laughing Laughing Rolling Eyes

Well it's simple. The reward is the pleasure of knowing that you helped the community understand the rules more clearly.

[Updated on: Mon, 18 February 2013 18:46]

      
Quit2
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Tue, 19 February 2013 11:47
I think I waited long enough to give a second answer. I want to help the community some more:
Landing Craft. See rules card for landing craft.
      
clexton27
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Tue, 19 February 2013 13:49
Quit2 wrote on Tue, 19 February 2013 05:47

I think I waited long enough to give a second answer. I want to help the community some more:
Landing Craft. See rules card for landing craft.


Yes, good job. LANDING CRAFT are one of the more obscure answers as we don't often think about a unit coming from the sea, but they may not land on a hex with a Hedgehog.

[Updated on: Tue, 19 February 2013 13:49]

      
ad79
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Tue, 19 February 2013 23:13
Tank Destroyers can't enter Hedgehog hexes
      
clexton27
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Wed, 20 February 2013 00:07
Great Stig. Yep, since TANK DESTROYERS are treated like Armor they along with other Armor units may not enter a HEDGEHOG hex.
      
Michael Von Älterman
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Wed, 20 February 2013 17:55
the command car is also not allowed
      
clexton27
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Wed, 20 February 2013 19:23
Michael, I believe you are correct. Good catch!

COMMAND CARS are listed as Vehicles in the FAQ:
Quote:

Q: Which units are considered Vehicles in Memoir '44?
A: Vehicles are Armor units (including Hobart's Funnies, Tigers, and Tank Destroyers), Patrol Cars, Command Cars, Half-Tracks, and Supply Trucks. The following are not considered Vehicles: Artillery (including Mobile Artillery), Trains, Landing Craft, Aircraft Carriers, Destroyers, Airplanes, and Cavalry.


So since they are vehicles, as such they will not be able to enter a Hedgehog.

[Updated on: Thu, 21 February 2013 00:47]

      
Michael Von Älterman
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Thu, 21 February 2013 00:59
I think we've got them all now
      
clexton27
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Fri, 22 February 2013 19:02
Michael Von Älterman wrote on Wed, 20 February 2013 18:59

I think we've got them all now


Granted the FAQ answer about Vehicles was a cheat and gave the answers:
HOBARTS FUNNIES and TIGERS, however, I still have four items which have not been specifically mentioned yet. I can't believe that we are going to stump you guys. So feel free to give as many of the remainng answers all at once.
      
Quit2
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Fri, 22 February 2013 19:44
can you give the answers you already struck from the list?
With some people giving more than one answer in one post, or some "general" answers, it's not easy to know what has been said already
      
Quit2
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Fri, 22 February 2013 19:48
Flak 88
Long tom
Screaming meemies
Mobile artillery

are all artillery and can therfor not enter a hex with a hedgehog
      
clexton27
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Re:General stevens Rules Quiz No.6 Fri, 22 February 2013 20:41
Quit2 wrote on Fri, 22 February 2013 13:48

Flak 88
Long tom
Screaming meemies
Mobile artillery

are all artillery and can therfor not enter a hex with a hedgehog


Excellent, excellent!

FLAK 88 (Heavy Anti-Tank Gun)
LONG TOM (Big Guns)
NEBELWERFERS (Screaming Meemies)
MOBILE ARTILLERY (M7 Priest)


Yes, they are all a form of Artillery. My favorite answer being the Priest because it is both Armor tracked (hence Armor) and an Artillery piece so it makes the restrictions on both counts.

Last but not least let us consider the ITALIAN ARTILLERY
since it is a separate equipment piece now included in the
Equipment Pack.

Good job guys, and thanks for showing your restraint until the end Quit2...
Laughing
      
    
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