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sam1812
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Road block question Tue, 16 April 2013 06:48
This situation just came up in a game, and my opponent and I had opposite, unshakable beliefs about it.

A regular infantry starts its turn on a Road hex with a Road Block.

Does it get the road movement bonus when it moves off? (Can it move 2 and battle, if it moves off along the Road?)
      
rasmussen81
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Re:Road block question Tue, 16 April 2013 07:21
sam1812 wrote on Tue, 16 April 2013 08:48

This situation just came up in a game, and my opponent and I had opposite, unshakable beliefs about it.

A regular infantry starts its turn on a Road hex with a Road Block.

Does it get the road movement bonus when it moves off? (Can it move 2 and battle, if it moves off along the Road?)


Yes. If it started on the road, and stayed on the road, it can move two and still battle. The starting terrain (unless specifically stated) does not affect your movement.

So who was right?! Cool
      
Almilcar
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Re:Road block question Tue, 16 April 2013 07:50
Hello,

I'm not Sam's opponent in that game, but I do understand that there may be some doubts about that.

I can't understand why a road block doesn't affect while a bridge tile, If I'm not worng, prevents a unit of getting the bonus road.
      
Achtung Panzer
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Re:Road block question Tue, 16 April 2013 10:00
Almilcar wrote on Tue, 16 April 2013 06:50

I can't understand why a road block doesn't affect while a bridge tile, If I'm not worng, prevents a unit of getting the bonus road.


I guess it's because the Inf started its move on the road / roadblock hex and then left it as it moved down the road. A Bridge represents a pinch-point in the road (likely traffic jams) and that is why a unit does not get the road bonus on its journey.
      
rasmussen81
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Re:Road block question Tue, 16 April 2013 10:19
Achtung Panzer wrote on Tue, 16 April 2013 12:00

Almilcar wrote on Tue, 16 April 2013 06:50

I can't understand why a road block doesn't affect while a bridge tile, If I'm not worng, prevents a unit of getting the bonus road.


I guess it's because the Inf started its move on the road / roadblock hex and then left it as it moved down the road. A Bridge represents a pinch-point in the road (likely traffic jams) and that is why a unit does not get the road bonus on its journey.



I agree. That's my thinking as well. Smile
      
sam1812
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Re:Road block question Tue, 16 April 2013 14:13
rasmussen81 wrote on Tue, 16 April 2013 01:21

So who was right?! Cool

Thanks for the quick answer.

To answer your question, Ras, let's put it this way: Since roadblocks normally occur on roads, if a unit would be denied the road movement bonus when moving off, it certainly would have said so on the summary card -- and it doesn't. Smile

[Updated on: Tue, 16 April 2013 14:14]

      
stevens
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Re:Road block question Tue, 16 April 2013 16:11
I guess the struggle with the question is the phrase "begins its movement on a road". Since the roadblock itself is also on the road hex it creates a little confusion, but I am glad you guys cleared it up.
      
Flemish_Havy
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Re:Road block question Sun, 04 August 2013 18:18
dear sirs,

as a road block has a diffrent 'terrain reference card', i cant see why you would EVER treat it as a 'road hex' !?
This terrain hex has its own 'specific rules'. Rolling Eyes

The only comparison to 'a road hex' is 'in the name' off this hex, it says 'road'. It could have easily bin named 'pile off rubble' or only 'obstruction'.

If you have an 'abatis' on the road, that is also a 'pile off rubble', it rules the same, since it is a 'diffrent terrain hex'.

So to reply on your original question: " it aint a 'road hex', so you can't apply the 'road movement bonus' rules on it ! " Shocked

" If a unit starts on a Road and stays on the Road for the entire move, you get the extra hex movement option. " (FAQ)
/-> so it mentions the 'starting point', the course to follow and the 'end point' having to be a road hex ! Rolling Eyes

I feel you can easily compare it to a 'bridge hex' who also does NOT give you the road movement bonus. A bridge hex, compares with a road hex in 'drawings', but thats it.

If you start on a bridge, do you get the extra hex ?
NO. You didnt start on a road hex.


Comparing it to real world physics:
----------------------------------
'the road bonus move': "you are getting a 'distance' bonus by starting in, moving along and ending on a hardened 'easy to move' on terrain, compared to the distance you would travel onto open ground, in the same time passed = in this case 'a game turn '.

If you start in 'a pile off rubble', you ll have a hard time to get moving, so you loose the distance bonus for 'easy terrain'. Same if you would end into it, since your movement would be 'slowed down'.
Also remember the specific terrain rules mentioning you have to STOP moving into that terrain. Your movement is 'harmed' by beign in there.

Following this idea and comparing it to a 'bridge', the idea sticks, since to get over a bridge, you could be 'hampered' also.
It narrows the road, you 'climb' the hight off the bridge ... .


Finaly: " I gess you could make this a FAQ question and get the overall correct answer by Richard Borg. "

Q: If you start or end your move on a 'road block' or 'abbatis', can you apply the road bonus movement, to move an extra hex ?

/-> when i read the above, it almost gives me the answer and looks to be self explaining. Rolling Eyes

A: NO, since both road blocks and abbatis have there own terrain rules and are not just 'road hexes'.
" Only if a unit starts on a Road and stays on the Road for the entire move, you get the extra hex movement option. "

[Updated on: Sun, 04 August 2013 19:26]

      
sam1812
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Re:Road block question Sun, 04 August 2013 23:28
I guess if there's a Road Block or Abatis obstacle on a Road hex, the hex is still a Road. Or to think of it another way, I guess the obstacle doesn't take up the entire length of the hex.
      
Almilcar
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Re:Road block question Mon, 05 August 2013 01:01
Out of topic

so glad to read you again, Henk

regards
      
Aussie_Digger
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Re:Road block question Mon, 05 August 2013 09:08
Flemish_Havy wrote on Mon, 05 August 2013 01:48

dear sirs,

as a road block has a diffrent 'terrain reference card', i cant see why you would EVER treat it as a 'road hex' !?
This terrain hex has its own 'specific rules'. Rolling Eyes


So dose sandbags and wire but you still take into account the hex type that it is placed on.

using logic from your post, if the roadblock was on a hill hex that had a road then LOS wouldnt be blocked since roadblocks dont block LOS, and from your post you are suggesting that the roadblock Terrain card means you ignore the hex that is under it since the roadblock has its own terrain rules.

After reading the rules I would agree with others that if you start on a road hex with a road block and move along road hexes you would get the bonus.

As the rules read regarding roads, they refer to it as a road hex but when the rules refer to a roadblock they refer to them being in a hex, not a hex themselves eg (An Infantry unit that enters a hex with a roadblock must stop....)

The Terrian rules for the roadblocks have rules that stop you contiuning road movement but nothing to stop you from starting roadmovement. I think if it was the intension to prevent it then it would have a similar rule like the marsh hex where you must end movement after leaving the hex.
      
rasmussen81
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Re:Road block question Mon, 05 August 2013 15:19
In this situation, it might be helpful to replace the Roadblock word with Barbed Wire. How does Barbed Wire work if a unit starts in the hex with it, and moves out? We can see that even though Barbed Wire restricts movement when you enter the hex, it doesn't do anything if you start in it and move away. The same principle applies to Roadblocks. Cool
      
Flemish_Havy
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Re:Road block question Tue, 06 August 2013 19:42
so you guys regard the roadblock or abatis as an 'addon' to the hex below ?

ok, then addon a 'bunker' on a road hex, its still a road hex or not ?
      
rasmussen81
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Re:Road block question Tue, 06 August 2013 20:42
Flemish_Havy wrote on Tue, 06 August 2013 21:42

so you guys regard the roadblock or abatis as an 'addon' to the hex below ?

ok, then addon a 'bunker' on a road hex, its still a road hex or not ?


We're welcome to speculate about what would happen if a Bunker was placed on a road, but until an Official scenario has one of those (which they don't, as far as I know) we won't have any kind of official answer.
      
Aussie_Digger
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Re:Road block question Wed, 07 August 2013 01:17
Flemish_Havy wrote on Wed, 07 August 2013 03:12

so you guys regard the roadblock or abatis as an 'addon' to the hex below ?

ok, then addon a 'bunker' on a road hex, its still a road hex or not ?


I do concider it an addon to the under hex.

A bunker on a road would stop tanks and artillery from moving through since the bunkers are impassable to them.

Infantry would still get the road bonus if the inf unit was moving through or starting on the hex (the rules do not make the inf unit end its movement when entering)
      
    
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