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Sagrilarus
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First Lieutenant

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January 2005
Shadows should be the next online game. Sun, 05 March 2006 03:54
I've looked at them all carefully, and Shadows Over Camelot should be the next online game.

I'm a software engineer and I program applets -- Shadows would be a cake walk compared to most of the other games to code. Essentially no strategy to code at all. Amount of animation needed is minimal. Any number of players 3-7 can play which would be GREATLY appreciated by the QN/FoD players. The only thing that holds it back is the sheer size of the boards. But! they could be rendered either in separate windows (which would be way-cool) or by clicking on a zoom-out of the playing area that brings up a certain board in closer detail.

The nature of the play would be interesting to watch unfold. The one thing that would absolutely have to be addressed is a way to give feedback on other players, so that people couldn't be rogue traitors (i.e., when they didn't get the card) without paying a price.

And you may want to put a link to the skype download page, 'cause people are going to want to talk.

Shadows would be an excellent choice. Easy to code, easy to test. No need for bots. You could have it up in a month. Hell -- put me on the payroll!

Sag.
      
AK_Aramis
Senior Member

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Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Thu, 09 March 2006 08:14
That would rock!
      
Myxlstyx
Junior Member

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March 2006
  Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Wed, 29 March 2006 23:59
I would be totally up for on online version of this game. I mean.. I'm already addicted to the board game. Must.. have... more... shadows...!

And I totally agree that the abscence of needing an A.I. makes it wicked easy to program. Just randomize the cards, randomize the knights - make sure the program follows the rules. Smile The only tricky part would be deciding how the interface would work when the group needs to decide how to drop 3 merlin cards to cancel the black special.

*prays for online version*
      
Luke the Flaming
Senior Member

Posts: 270
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July 2003
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Thu, 30 March 2006 02:06
SoC relies more than the majority of games on "interaction": words, glazes, opinions... Discussing "who will do what" and "why you didn't do that" are half of the game. That would be scarcer in an online version (if you ever tried to play boardgames online, you'll have noticed how few - if any! - words are spent each time; it's simply more uncomfortable as writing is slower than speaking and maybe not all players share a common language).
The "hardware" part of SoC is probably easy to convert in an online format, but the "software" is much trickier...

(Of course, if they'd do that, I'll surely - and gladly - try it! Smile )
      
Myxlstyx
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March 2006
  Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Thu, 30 March 2006 02:55
Indeed, I haven't played a lot of online board games. And I totally understand your point about communication as it is a very social game. I could see the initial game startup taking awhile as the group discusses where to dispatch the knights. The language barrier could be a problem... Now I haven't seen how DOW's other online games are set up (though I plan on it, once i read through the rules) - but is there the possibility of setting up a game as an "German" or "English" game at game creation?
      
Sagrilarus
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January 2005
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Thu, 30 March 2006 16:04
http://www.skype.com

You can specify the language in the name of the game you create (or make it an option) although I always name my Ticket to Ride games "For Slow Stupid People" and get people complaining I don't play fast enough.

Sag.
      
Quizoid
Junior Member

Posts: 18
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February 2006
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Mon, 11 December 2006 16:16
Sagrilarus wrote on Thu, 30 March 2006 07:04

http://www.skype.com

You can specify the language in the name of the game you create (or make it an option) although I always name my Ticket to Ride games "For Slow Stupid People" and get people complaining I don't play fast enough.

Sag.


I once felt like playing a Ticket to Ride game that was more social. So I entitled it "Conversational Ticket to Ride Game" and limited it to four people.

One dropped.
One complained on his way out.
And I had a lovely conversation with the third. (O:
      
Quizoid
Junior Member

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February 2006
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Mon, 11 December 2006 16:18
I totally agree that Shadows would be a rad online game. I think they're doing Memoir '44 next, though.

I just think Shadows would be a lot of fun online. It would probably be more difficult though, especially if you got a traitor-accusing happy player, or whatnot. It would be harder to talk people down from accusing, because they'd be able to do it with the click of a button (O:

I think that player interaction, and playing with a whole mess of personalities could be fun.
      
Quizoid
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February 2006
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Mon, 11 December 2006 16:23
Quizoid wrote on Mon, 11 December 2006 08:18

I totally agree that Shadows would be a rad online game. I think they're doing Memoir '44 next, though.

I just think Shadows would be a lot of fun online. It would probably be more difficult though, especially if you got a traitor-accusing happy player, or whatnot. It would be harder to talk people down from accusing, because they'd be able to do it with the click of a button (O:

I think that player interaction, and playing with a whole mess of personalities could be fun.


Just to reply to myself:

Maybe that issue could be fixed. After someone accuses someone of being traitor, everyone can enter in a line of text. And, the accuser sees what everyone says before hitting "confirm accusation."

Just thought of another problem though, which is table talk. That might be somewhat fixable with a filter. No numbers, and no words like, "Card, Point, etc..."

Also, they could have clickable options of things you can say, with no typing options. Ex: "I could use some help, here!" "I can't hold on much longer!" "I'm confident I can beat them myself!"

The creator could even choose from among these features. Ex: "Chat: off (clickable sentences only)" "Traitor Chat: On"

I wonder if the table talk issue has been a reason they've wanted to stay away from this.
      
signofthetiger
Junior Member

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July 2005
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Fri, 15 December 2006 08:40
I would definitely be up to playing SoC online, but being a cooperative game, it does require a lot of verbal interaction between players whether its dividing up cards or discussing which quests to undertake. Playing as King Arthur would also require chat to persuade him to trade you a card. al

I think its good idea, but maybe SoC would be better done as a separate computer game, rather than hosted online. Confused
      
saphira5
Junior Member

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January 2007
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Fri, 05 January 2007 17:53
sounds an awesome plan
i wouldnt be able to get off

Saphira the dragon who kicks dragons butts
      
Lucas_v1
Junior Member

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June 2007
  Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Thu, 07 June 2007 22:46
Hi everyone, this is my first post. Just received the game as a super-present.

Re communication, it could be programmed as a graphical user-interface, where the (minimal) text that each user sees is uniformly translated. The idea is from a game called "Diplomacy", where you make alliances with others / the computer. There are signs for each alliance-clause, which people can then approve or reject.

Setting this up for Shadows over Camelot would be easier in terms of important functions (i.e. a "cards" control for the card exchanges & collection) and, if reasonable, another control for general strategic moves (i.e. with arrows pointing to the action you would take).

I wish it would go online!

Lucas
      
Agrajag
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Posts: 32
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July 2005
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Thu, 21 June 2007 07:32
Forgive me for the divergent view but this is all pretty wishful thinking. SoC is one of my favorite games but would make a lousy online game if not done just right.

First, it's a game of total social interaction. Settlers I prefer to play online because I can take a 90 minute game and play it with GOOD AI in 9 minutes. Ticket to Ride can be fun with okay AI and played quickly.

Online players do NOT generally like any kind of online experience that drags. SoC would DRAG online by comparison.

Also, the idea that AI is not needed just doesn't wash. SoC, like any of these games, would require daunting AI. Not including AI is a recipe for disaster. The other games have AI because the bulk of the audience wants it that way. They don't want to play a bunch of people they don't know at all.

I would love to have the option of playing SoC online with a bunch of friends but it would not happen often enough to make it viable as a business decision in my view.
      
Luke the Flaming
Senior Member

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July 2003
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Thu, 21 June 2007 12:46
Agrajag wrote on Thu, 21 June 2007 07:32

Not including AI is a recipe for disaster. The other games have AI because the bulk of the audience wants it that way. They don't want to play a bunch of people they don't know at all.

While I agree with most of your post, this sentence is wrong (in my opinion). It may be true for a website with few games and a "small" pool of players (like DOW site), but the success of websites like BSW proves that no AI is necessary (even if it could be a welcome addition).
      
Agrajag
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July 2005
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Thu, 21 June 2007 18:55
How much money is BSW making? None.

How many players does BSW get? Very little comparatively. Look around at the games that aren't hot at the moment and you find the place to be a ghost town much of the time. This is, in part, due to lack of AI as an option. I would be on there a lot more if AI were a part of the equation.

BSW does nothing to prove this position. If anything it points to the opposite. However, I don't want to state it quite as such as I personally believe BSW is hindered by some other problems more than AI.
      
Luke the Flaming
Senior Member

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July 2003
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Thu, 21 June 2007 19:48
Agrajag wrote on Thu, 21 June 2007 18:55

How much money is BSW making? None.

How many players does BSW get? Very little comparatively. Look around at the games that aren't hot at the moment and you find the place to be a ghost town much of the time. This is, in part, due to lack of AI as an option. I would be on there a lot more if AI were a part of the equation.

BSW does nothing to prove this position. If anything it points to the opposite. However, I don't want to state it quite as such as I personally believe BSW is hindered by some other problems more than AI.


Probably it's all part of the same idea: since BSW doesn't aim to "make money", it doesn't feel the need to build AIs (or to improve the interface, or the reduce the scaring impact of the - mostly useless - "metagame" on newbies, etc.).
However, there're still a lot of registered users and plenty of games going on at every hour of the day, so it probably reaches its goal (justifing why its creators make - or don't make - the choices listed above).
Have fun! Smile
      
Agrajag
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July 2005
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Thu, 21 June 2007 19:55
Yep, that's why I didn't want to get caught up on saying this was BSW's main issue. They have a myriad of issues in my view. I've worked for a game portal in the past and this one just boggles my mind on the things they do.

Days of Wonder, in my view, gets it much more than the BSW guys do.
      
Timlagor
Junior Member

Posts: 3
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September 2007
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Sun, 09 September 2007 18:25
I cam elooking to try SoC online. Very disappointed that it's not there. I would be entirely happy for there not to be an AI.

My computer doesn't like skype ..I'd think it would be worth running a ventrilo server for though.
      
rdhight
Junior Member

Posts: 27
Registered:
October 2007
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Fri, 12 October 2007 14:55
I wonder what would happen to the requirements for wink-wink beating around the bush when it comes to card names. I can see a few people sitting at their computers, having a good time writing overblown fake dialogue and taking forever to make a move, but I think the more likely outcome is that the restrictions would get even more grating than they are in real life, people would get impatient, and you'd see a lot of hastily typed:

--i have 2-3-4 fight
--Need grail
--will trade peity to gala, need fight back
      
wickedtinkers
Junior Member

Posts: 1
Registered:
November 2007
  Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Tue, 20 November 2007 21:45
That would be soo- amazing!! my friends are all at college so i have no one to play shadows with
      
Charleson
Junior Member
Cadet

Posts: 20
Registered:
April 2007
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Mon, 26 November 2007 04:32
There's a Vassal module for SoC out there. I didn't see it getting a lot of play though. Sad
      
rpwk
Junior Member

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August 2006
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Fri, 04 January 2008 23:14
is there a computer version of shadows at all anywhere ?!
would love to try it !

      
nephster
Junior Member

Posts: 2
Registered:
January 2008
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Sat, 26 January 2008 08:18
I agree it would be nice to have this online. I've bought two Days of Wonder games, and neither are online: Shadows over Camelot, and Pirate's Cove. I was pretty bummed to discover that neither one was available; I assumed, from the "web code" included in the instructions PLUS the prominent "web code" graphic on the actual sites for both games, that the web code actually applied to these games.

I don't personally have an issue with the lack of social interaction that you typically have in a SOC game. If people are expressive with chats, it should be fine. And if you think about it, a "silent" game of SOC would be an interesting thing, too, since it would really reward astute observation...

      
Timlagor
Junior Member

Posts: 3
Registered:
September 2007
Re:Shadows should be the next online game. Wed, 02 April 2008 03:46
Well this is the second time (with a BIG gap) that I've come here looking for online SoC ...still no luck.

See you in another 6-12 months.

[Updated on: Wed, 02 April 2008 03:46]

      
    
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