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sam1812
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Re: Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sat, 22 March 2014 14:24
Quit2 wrote on Sat, 22 March 2014 08:40

Rasmussen,

Do you have access to the table size needed to play 1, 2, 3, 6 maps? Taking into account the way they should be aligned, of course.

Thanks in advance.

The setup is staggered after 3 boards.

3 boards together would be 7 feet (214 cm) wide, so they would fit on two tables that are each 8 feet x 30 inches (244 cm x 77 cm). I don't know what the standard table sizes are in Europe.

So the 6-board game would fit on four 8' x 30" tables.
      
Almilcar
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Re: Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sat, 22 March 2014 14:48
sam1812 wrote on Sat, 22 March 2014 14:15

ad79 wrote on Sat, 22 March 2014 06:20

Quit2 wrote on Sat, 22 March 2014 11:17

Or mark (paint?) all the figures that you bring to the table in your own unique style.


A simple coloured dot under the unit will also help with that.


FYI, I learned the hard way that paint markers never dry on the bottoms of the plastic pieces.


We have marked ours with a PILOT permanent ink marker and worked like a charm. Not sure what type did you use.
      
rasmussen81
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Re: Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sat, 22 March 2014 14:50
Almilcar wrote on Sat, 22 March 2014 06:48

sam1812 wrote on Sat, 22 March 2014 14:15

ad79 wrote on Sat, 22 March 2014 06:20

Quit2 wrote on Sat, 22 March 2014 11:17

Or mark (paint?) all the figures that you bring to the table in your own unique style.


A simple coloured dot under the unit will also help with that.


FYI, I learned the hard way that paint markers never dry on the bottoms of the plastic pieces.


We have marked ours with a PILOT permanent ink marker and worked like a charm. Not sure what type did you use.


I've used Sharpie permanent markers on the bottom of all my units as well. It's lasted 6 years without any trouble and makes it really fast to organize. Cool
      
Jeronimon
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Re: Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sat, 22 March 2014 15:26
Quit2 wrote on Sat, 22 March 2014 13:40

Rasmussen,

Do you have access to the table size needed to play 1, 2, 3, 6 maps? Taking into account the way they should be aligned, of course.

Thanks in advance.


Hi Quit, I will quote myself:

Jeronimon wrote on Thu, 20 March 2014 20:25

Well being lazy I wasn't going to do that, but you stimulated me to do it. Smile

One board will measure:

width: 70,6 centimeters (about 28 inches)
depth: 114 cm (about 45 inches)


Total map, all six layer out with the staggering:

width: 423 cm (about 14 feet)
depth: 151 cm (about 5 feet, almost 60 inches)


I wil go scout for (a) table(s) then. Wink


Adding to this:

Two board widt is then 141 cm
Three boards is 212 cm

The depth depends on which ones you put together if they align (playing OMAHA UTAH and AMERICAN AIRBORNE) the board depth is 114 cm.

If you add Gold to the side of Omaha you will need about an extra 28 cm adding up to 142 cm.

Adding Sword on the far left will add about 10 cm, but you will lose the 28 offset for GOLD-OMAHA unless you are playing with more than 3 boards, so board depth is only 124 cm

In summary:

One board:
width: 71 cm
depth: 114 cm

two boards:
width: 142 cm

depth:
Juno Gold/Omaha Utah/Utah American Airborne: 114cm
Sword Juno: 124
Gold Omaha: 142 cm


Three boards:
width: 212 cm

depth:
Sword Juno Gold: 124 cm
Juno Gold Omaha/Gold Omaha Utah: 142 cm
Omaha Utah American Airborne: 114cm


Total
Width: 423 cm
Depth: 151 cm


Remember these are the board sizes, if you want to put other stuff on the table you need a bit of spare room (although the offset gives you some Smile )
      
gheintze
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sat, 22 March 2014 21:44
If figures are the problem, there are counters in the Overlord Expansion that could be used. Also, I wonder if DoW would make packs of figures available for those of us that are insane enough to want to play this. Smile

Geoff
      
Turboheizer
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sun, 23 March 2014 10:42
Hmm ... if the Neptune maps are laid out on giant table, will there be problems for the players when trying to reach the figures placed on the innermost hexes?
      
Dietrich von Kleist
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sun, 23 March 2014 11:03
Turboheizer wrote on Sun, 23 March 2014 10:42

Hmm ... if the Neptune maps are laid out on giant table, will there be problems for the players when trying to reach the figures placed on the innermost hexes?


I guess the next expansion will be a set of "unit moving sticks". Cool

http://www.subbrit.org.uk/rsg/sites/w/wartling/r3_control_room.jpg
      
clexton27
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sun, 23 March 2014 12:42
Maybe we just need some fancy pot passing sticks and a sturdy table.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8g_LkfsIuFw
      
rasmussen81
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sun, 23 March 2014 16:11
Turboheizer wrote on Sun, 23 March 2014 02:42

Hmm ... if the Neptune maps are laid out on giant table, will there be problems for the players when trying to reach the figures placed on the innermost hexes?


Do you have problems reaching units in the center of the Breakthrough boards? If so, you might want to start growing your arms a bit longer... Very Happy
      
Turboheizer
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sun, 23 March 2014 17:07
Well, the new maps are 33% longer than the standard Breakthrough, and I think it was yourself who indicated a depth of 151 cm. Thus, it is nearly impossible to reach the other edge of the board from your side of the table, and it is still inconvenient to reach the center area while sitting on a chair, although possible while standing. To reach the other edge of Gold Beach or Omaha Beach, you would have to walk around the 4,23 m table. I don't think I will ever be in that position, but it is still something I thought about as soon as I learned about the map dimensions.

By the way, we still know very little about the new reinforcement concept. Is the number of reinforcements limited in any way, or could a whole second army brought onto the map during a match?
      
player684858
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sun, 23 March 2014 17:45
Any idea if we are going to get Canadian troops in the future? I think a Canadian/Italian Army pack would be super! You have to have the Canadians for D-Day, they were probably 1/3 of the British invasion force!
      
Quit2
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sun, 23 March 2014 17:51
You have them already. They are part of the British Commonwealth Forces. (Mediterranean pack)
      
bdgza
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sun, 23 March 2014 18:30
This is most likely how I'll play it when I have my copy in June (based on the preview image of Sword Beach posted on BGG).

http://cf.geekdo-images.com/images/pic1968113.png
      
gonzalan
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sun, 23 March 2014 18:41
Wow, impressive, lots to cover and a formidable challenge no doubt!!

3 short months away or so....

      
clexton27
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sun, 23 March 2014 18:47
Yes, looking forward to your update to VASSAL in June Bart!
      
Kaufschtick
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  Re: Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sun, 23 March 2014 19:09
stevens wrote on Sat, 22 March 2014 07:15

As an aside:
If you live with pets and play on the floor just plan for some unit attrition.
Last time I did this the dog ate one land mine and half a sandbag while we were on break.
Fortunately, the mine was diffused.
Rolling Eyes Very Happy Shocked Laughing


LOL! Very Happy
      
Dietrich von Kleist
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sun, 23 March 2014 19:44
Quit2 wrote on Sun, 23 March 2014 17:51

You have them already. They are part of the British Commonwealth Forces. (Mediterranean pack)



That's right, but I don't think they wore shorts on D-Day. Smile
      
rasmussen81
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sun, 23 March 2014 19:58
I found a little bit of time and looked over the maps to see what tokens are needed...here's what I discovered:

-Sword Beach-
Entry Markers ~ 6
Star Tokens ~ 6
Cross-hair Markers ~ 3
Landing Craft ~ 6
Anti Tank SWA ~ 1
Pegasus Badge ~ 9
Big Guns Badge ~ 2
Nebelwrfer ~ 1
British Medals ~ 5


-Juno Beach-
Entry Markers ~ 2
Star Tokens ~ 6
Cross-hair Markers ~ 3
Landing Craft ~ 6
Anti Tank SWA ~ 1
Mortar SWA ~ 1
Machine Gun SWA ~ 1
German Engineer Badge ~ 1
Big Guns Badge ~ 2
Flak 88 ~ 1
German Elite ~ 2
British Medals ~ 2
British Special Forces ~ 1
Destroyer ~ 1


-Gold Beach-
Entry Markers ~ 2
Exit Markers - 4
Star Tokens ~ 2
Landing Craft ~ 6
Machine Gun SWA ~ 1
German Engineer Badge ~ 1
Big Guns Badge ~ 1
Flak 88 ~ 1
German Elite ~ 2
British Medals ~ 4
British Special Forces ~ 1


-Omaha Beach-
Entry Markers ~ 2
Star Tokens ~ 8
Cross-hair Markers ~ 1
Landing Craft ~ 6
Rangers ~ 2
Machine Gun SWA ~ 1
German Elite ~ 1
Destroyer ~ 1


-Utah Beach-
Entry Markers ~ 2
Exit Markers ~ 4
Star Tokens ~ 6
Cross-hair Markers ~ 3
Landing Craft ~ 6
German Elite ~ 2
Big Guns Badge ~ 2
Rangers ~ 3
American Medals ~ 4
Destroyer ~ 1


-American Airborne-
Entry Markers ~ 4
Exit Markers - 2
Star Tokens ~ 3
Cross-hair Markers ~ 1
Airborne Badges ~ 11
Big Guns Badge ~ 1
German Elite ~ 2
American Medals ~ 4


Operation Neptune Note: I don't have the time to figure out how many badges and tokens it would take for all of the map combinations, but if you wanted to play Operation Neptune, and if I've counted right, you would need:
Entry Markers ~ 18
Exit Markers - 10
Star Tokens ~ 31
Cross-hair Markers ~ 8
Landing Craft ~ 30
Anti Tank SWA ~ 2
Mortar SWA ~ 1
Machine Gun SWA ~ 3
German Engineer Badge ~ 2
Big Guns Badge ~ 8
Flak 88 ~ 2
Nebelwrfer ~ 1
German Elite ~ 9
British Medals ~ 11
British Special Forces ~ 2
US Airborne Badges ~ 11
Pegasus Badges ~ 9
German Elite ~ 9
American Medals ~ 8
Destroyers ~ 4
Rangers ~ 5
      
Antoi
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Re: Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sun, 23 March 2014 20:08
stevens wrote on Sat, 22 March 2014 12:15


It seems like the one thing that would be the most helpful for folks would be the ability to get extra decks of BREAKTHROUGH Command Cards without having to purchase the entire Winter Wars set. It would be a nice bonus if these were sold separately and a greater incentive to purchase the D-Day Landings Map Set.


This would be great I think. I hope they make them available separate. Untill they do, you can ofcoure combine other decks to make a breakthrough deck. If you own 2 base games or one overlord you can make anther Breakthrough deck.
You just have to make some kind of summary to remember some specific cards (airpower, barrage, M&C, which cards have on the move) who are different

Lucky I have enough players around. We only need a table big enough to play the six map game Laughing
      
bdgza
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sun, 23 March 2014 20:13
Even digitally this will be massive! Shocked

http://cf.geekdo-images.com/images/pic1968223.jpg

Full image: http://cf.geekdo-images.com/images/pic1968223.jpg

[Updated on: Sun, 23 March 2014 20:14]

      
sam1812
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sun, 23 March 2014 20:49
The size of the board doesn't look like a problem for me in Vassal. I just need a bigger desk and two more computer screens.

Smile
      
Quit2
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Sun, 23 March 2014 21:02
Bart,

would it be possible to make it in such a way that besides being able to zoom (and scroll) the whole thing (board, side board and compendium panel), you would also be able to zoom (and scroll) only the board part.
When playing 6 vs 6, each player will mostly be watching his board and maybe some part of his two neighbours, while only occasionally scrolling to other parts.
      
Turboheizer
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 00:07
Hmmm ... Ras listed a total of 10 British Infantry units for Sword Beach (in which case one Med expansion would be sufficient to play the map), but maybe he forgot to count in the Paras? Looks as if it are 19 units in total, so I guess I need another set of figures.

By the way, I don't want to nit-pick, but as we have a nice bascule bridge tile looking just like the real Pegasus Bridge, why is there a tied-arch bridge on the pre-printed map? It looks more like Arnheim Bridge.
      
bdgza
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 00:18
Quit2 wrote on Sun, 23 March 2014 21:02

Bart,

would it be possible to make it in such a way that besides being able to zoom (and scroll) the whole thing (board, side board and compendium panel), you would also be able to zoom (and scroll) only the board part.
When playing 6 vs 6, each player will mostly be watching his board and maybe some part of his two neighbours, while only occasionally scrolling to other parts.


No, that is not possible. The "Center on opponent's moves?" checkbox is a VASSAL option for the entire module only, and there is no way to restrict anything.
      
rasmussen81
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 00:36
Turboheizer wrote on Sun, 23 March 2014 16:07

Hmmm ... Ras listed a total of 10 British Infantry units for Sword Beach (in which case one Med expansion would be sufficient to play the map), but maybe he forgot to count in the Paras? Looks as if it are 19 units in total, so I guess I need another set of figures.


Indeed, you are correct! I didn't include the British Airborne troops, so there would be 19 Allied Infantry needed for that scenario. I'll go back and fix that in my other posts.

Thanks for catching it. Cool
      
clexton27
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 00:41
bdgza wrote on Sun, 23 March 2014 19:18

No, that is not possible. The "Center on opponent's moves?" checkbox is a VASSAL option for the entire module only, and there is no way to restrict anything.


But it doesn't seem improbable that on VASSAL you could extend the Breakthrough depth to 23 hexes so that two people could play a single scenario and if other people played the remaining scenario games simultaneously it might be possible for Operation Neptune?
They would just need to communicate with their flanks in some way.

[Updated on: Mon, 24 March 2014 00:45]

      
clexton27
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 00:44
rasmussen81 wrote on Sun, 23 March 2014 14:58

I found a little bit of time and looked over the maps to see what tokens are needed...here's what I discovered.


Thanks for all your work on this Jesse to help folks see what they need so they can start planning ahead.
      
Turboheizer
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 08:06
I'm still studying the Sword Beach map ... looks as if the Brits will have a hard time coming ashore, they are not even starting at the shoreline but at least one hex away from the beach. There is a wire on the rightmost coastline hex, and units are not allowed to battle on ocean hexes - does that mean that only tanks could remove that wire? Also, can landing craft enter hexes with wire? We only know about hedgehogs. And finally, what is the meaning of the two units (one tank and one infantry) marked with a battle star?
      
boersma8
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 09:07
I'm thinking I might have enough stuff to play even Operation neprune if I use Axis and Allies pieces instead of memoir '44 pieces. I have allthe A&A games, so this should give me enough Germans, Americans and Brits...(including artillery and tanks).
      
Turboheizer
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 10:19
Okay, I overlooked that the German player begins with only three cards, so the Brits have a better chance than I thought. I also discovered a German figure also marked with a battle star. But why are five of the German medal slots showing two medals, one large and one small? What is the medal count needed to win this map alone?
      
bdgza
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 10:47
stevens wrote on Mon, 24 March 2014 00:41

bdgza wrote on Sun, 23 March 2014 19:18

No, that is not possible. The "Center on opponent's moves?" checkbox is a VASSAL option for the entire module only, and there is no way to restrict anything.


But it doesn't seem improbable that on VASSAL you could extend the Breakthrough depth to 23 hexes so that two people could play a single scenario and if other people played the remaining scenario games simultaneously it might be possible for Operation Neptune?
They would just need to communicate with their flanks in some way.


As you can see from my images I have already extended the depth to 23 hexes.

Two people could play a single scenario, and two other people could play another single scenario. But VASSAL only allows you to watch 1 game, so you can't see the border region. So having one massive Neptune with 12/16 people is still the best I think. Having 8 Axis and 8 Allied hands for cards, and 6 deck windows with BT decks, and 2 with OL decks. No decks on the side board.

Axis/Allies
-> BT Deck 1
Axis/Allies 2
-> BT Deck 2
Axis/Allies 3
-> BT Deck 3
Axis/Allies 4
-> BT Deck 4
Axis/Allies 5
-> BT Deck 5
Axis/Allies 6
-> BT Deck 6
Axis/Allies CiC 1
-> OL Deck 1
Axis/Allies CiC 2
-> OL Deck 2
      
clexton27
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 11:26
Thanks for your time and thought on this Bart! Smile
      
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 15:11
Turboheizer wrote on Sun, 23 March 2014 09:07

By the way, we still know very little about the new reinforcement concept. Is the number of reinforcements limited in any way, or could a whole second army brought onto the map during a match?


The only limit players will have for reinforcements are that you must have an empty hex to bring the troops in on...and you must have available figures. This is why Richard recommends that players have extra sets available.

Each turn, a general will roll dice to see what type of reinforcement unit is available. There is a large (and very nice looking) table for players to refer to. Depending on their roll, players might be able to bring in a few different reinforcements or pick from a few unit types. Then their turn starts.

It certainly could result in a whole second army joining the battle, but it will depend on the length of the battle and the dice rolls. Cool It's a fun new element to these battles!
      
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 15:15
Turboheizer wrote on Mon, 24 March 2014 02:19

Okay, I overlooked that the German player begins with only three cards, so the Brits have a better chance than I thought. I also discovered a German figure also marked with a battle star. But why are five of the German medal slots showing two medals, one large and one small? What is the medal count needed to win this map alone?


The units marked with the Battle Stars are Supported Infantry units or Supported Armor units. Basically they are mixed units with cool new abilities that I'll let people discover when the rules come out. Wink

The 5 small Medals on the German medal track are there because the German player starts with that many medals! Very Happy They get these medals for controlling different areas of the board...based on the new Terrain Control rules. The Allies will have to try and earn those medals back while the Germans try to keep that advantage! Very fun tug-of-war in these battles. Cool
      
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 15:35
Thanks Jesse, for all the effort you are putting in for us. Cool
      
Turboheizer
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 15:38
Thanks for the insight, Jesse. Sounds like an interesting and appropriate concept for those large maps with their strategic dimensions, but I don't think that reinforcements should be allowed when playing standard maps on the tactical level. It is part of the M44 challenge that you have to get along with those units you have at game start. Imagine playing Pegasus Bridge with an additional 20 German units on the map ... yuck! Laughing
      
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Re: Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 17:01
Antoi wrote on Sun, 23 March 2014 19:08

stevens wrote on Sat, 22 March 2014 12:15


It seems like the one thing that would be the most helpful for folks would be the ability to get extra decks of BREAKTHROUGH Command Cards without having to purchase the entire Winter Wars set. It would be a nice bonus if these were sold separately and a greater incentive to purchase the D-Day Landings Map Set.


This would be great I think. I hope they make them available separate. Untill they do, you can ofcoure combine other decks to make a breakthrough deck. If you own 2 base games or one overlord you can make anther Breakthrough deck.
You just have to make some kind of summary to remember some specific cards (airpower, barrage, M&C, which cards have on the move) who are different

Lucky I have enough players around. We only need a table big enough to play the six map game Laughing



Individual Breakthrough decks would indeed be handy for when you want to put more than 1 or 2 boards together.

It's slightly frustrating to discover that you may require more copies of the Equipment Pack for each board you introduce .. whilst I have one copy myself, I know of no other players locally who own this expansion. Which makes playing 2 or more boards highly unlikely for me
      
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Re: Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 17:12
Jaykay2010 wrote on Mon, 24 March 2014 09:01


Individual Breakthrough decks would indeed be handy for when you want to put more than 1 or 2 boards together.

It's slightly frustrating to discover that you may require more copies of the Equipment Pack for each board you introduce .. whilst I have one copy myself, I know of no other players locally who own this expansion. Which makes playing 2 or more boards highly unlikely for me



Did you read my list of what you'll need? You'll notice that you can probably get away with 1 Equipment Pack for the Double Maps (and maybe even the Triple Maps), though you might have to get creative.

Be sure to check the lists I compiled before giving up on a board format!
      
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 17:28
Turboheizer wrote on Mon, 24 March 2014 07:38

Thanks for the insight, Jesse. Sounds like an interesting and appropriate concept for those large maps with their strategic dimensions, but I don't think that reinforcements should be allowed when playing standard maps on the tactical level. It is part of the M44 challenge that you have to get along with those units you have at game start. Imagine playing Pegasus Bridge with an additional 20 German units on the map ... yuck! Laughing


Of course this Reinforcement rule is new, so none of the other scenarios were tested with it...but you can only bring in 1 (or maybe 2 if you're lucky) new units each turn. So that would mean the Pegasus Bridge scenario lasted 20 turns if you have an additional 20 German units! It couldn't happen with a 4 medal limit. Rolling Eyes
      
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Re:D-Day Landings: An Inside Look! Mon, 24 March 2014 17:48
Although I'm not sold on this expansion, I just thought I'd comment about the card requirements.

Were I to buy this expansion, I would never play more than 3x3 probably mostly playing 2x2. Most likely I would play 2x2 with overlord rules using a single breakthrough deck or the overlord deck. I might even play 3x3 that way.

Certainly I would never buy additional WW expansions just to get a deck that is not even necessary. Recall, before the dedicated BT deck existed we played BT with a standard deck.

I would consider whipping out 3 of my standard decks to play 3x3 and its easy enough to remember the differences in cards:

Recon -> +2 on the move
Probe -> +2 on the move
Attack -> +1 on the move
Medics and Mech. -> use 4 dice
Air Power -> Both sides roll 2 dice

And there are more cards in the BT deck, but again, a minor issue that shouldn't stop anyone from playing the scenarios.

Seriously, tiny rule differences such as which card deck to use, will have negligible impact on the game, especially as they apply equally to both sides.

The biggest drawback I can think of is space and time. This is just not an expansion for the individual player. Why not just play any number of dedicated D-Day games and forget this expansion?

[Updated on: Mon, 24 March 2014 17:56]

      
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