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ColtsFan76
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Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Mon, 27 August 2007 20:49
As previously stated, I am going to assist Eric periodically and gather up the open questions on this forum. They could be questions that slipped through the cracks or items they have been hesitant to answer for whatever reasons.

I gathered the first set of these on Friday and Eric has sent the answers back today. This is a direct copy past of the Word document I sent him. As agreed when we arranged this, they may answer some questions with "no comment" since they plan on releasing the info at a later date.

If your question wasn't included, please direct me to the original thread and we can include it in the next go around (date to submit to be determined)

Quote:

Hi Brian,

As promised here are our answers (read and verified by Richard too).
...

Hope this helps,
best,
eric


BattleLore Open Questions as of 2007-AUG-24

Cliffs
Q: If friendly units are adjacent but separated by the edge of a cliff, do they still support each other?
A: Yes, unit in an adjacent hex still support each other.

Q: If an enemy unit is adjacent to an ordered unit on a cliff, may the ordered unit target a more distant enemy unit within range since it can't engage in melee?
A: No it can't.

Q: With the exception of the cliff face, are the remaining sides of the hex treated the same as an Elevated Terrain hex for LOS, movement and battle?
A: Yes

Goblins
Q: Are Hyena Riders considered Goblinoid? Do they only follow the Unit Card titled “Hyena Riders” or are they also subject to the Unit Card titled “Goblinoids”? In other words, how many hexes do they retreat per flag?
A: yes they are and both cards apply. The Hyena riders retreat 2 hex per flag.

Battle Axe
Q: If the Battle Axemen only roll one Sword On Shield against a cavalry unit, the hit is ignored. Can the SoS still be re-rolled for a bonus strike?
A: No. It is only the SoS that score a hit that are rerolled.

Horn Blowers
Q: When Command/Lore cards are played, how does that affect the Horn Blower and Helper Units?
A: As written in the rules, when a Command card or Lore card modifies more than one unit, the modifier may apply to both of the attacking units, and should be added to the total.

In other words, if the BattleLore card is played, do both the HB and Helper each receive a +1 die?
A: Yes

If Slow is played, is the Horn Blower capped at 2 dice and still receive the helper dice? Or is he capped at 2 dice no matter what?
A: If Slow is played on the Horn Blower unit, he is capped at 2d but still receives the total dice from the helper unit.

If the helper cannot contribute dice, is he allowed to attack elsewhere on his own?
A: No, since the Helper contributes his dice to the Horn Blower unit. Also note that the Helper unit is NOT the target of the Slow.

Creatures
Q: Can one player field multiple creatures?
A: Yes, but we will detail this in a future supplement
If so, does each level of those Creatures count as one level on the War Council? (i.e. If I have a Level 1 HIll Giant and a Level 1 Giant Spider, do I put 1 Lore Master token or 2 tokens on the creature spot on my War Council?
A: 2 tokens, but we will detail this in a future supplement

Q: Can one player/team field two of the same creature (i.e. 2 Hill Giants)? If so, does each creature get its own lair (i.e 2 Rock Piles)? If so, can each unit use either lair or must they be kept separated somehow?
A: Yes, yes, and yes they could use either interchangeably.

Q: Can both camps field the same creature if we have multiple copies of that creature? If so, do both creatures get their own Lair? If so, can the Pennant Hill Giant use the Standard HG's Rock Pile to toss rocks? If so, can the Pennant Summon Circle be used to summon the Standard Earth Elemental?
A: Yes; yes; and yes for the Hill giant (Hill Giants don't care much who they are fighting for nor whose rocks they pick and throw), but no for the Earth Elemental invocation circle (the other camp doesn't know the ritual of that particular invocation circle)

Q: Does any of the above answers get impacted if it is used in Reluctant Allies?
A: Don't believe any of the above answers would change in RA.

Q: When creatures are deployed through the Deployment Deck, do they also get their Lair?
A: Yes.


Q: When creatures are deployed on the Epic board, in what rows do you place their Lair? Are they placed in the 4th through 8th row like Landmarks?
A: Yes,

General
Q. Will DOW offer anymore comment on the HR/RR/FF debate? Another un-official houserule? Potential for new cards? More reasons why they feel they are valid as is?
A: No. Richard feels these cards are not a problem in the grand scope of things and in consideration of he knows of the future of BattleLore. We've also given an official "house rule" for those that want a lesser version of these cards. People who would rather play with their own house rule than the official rules or the official "lesser strength" house rule we gave are welcome to do so, but we will not get into ruling whose "house rules" are best suited, since this depends on the players' personal play style and taste.

Q. Now that the Goblin Marauders has shipped, has DOW come up with a plan on the banner replacement? What is the status of the card backs?
A: yes, details have been posted on the most recent blog entry.

[Updated on: Tue, 28 August 2007 19:47] by Moderator

      
bcpravel
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Mon, 27 August 2007 21:10
Thanks so much for doing this. This is fantastic!
      
ColtsFan76
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Mon, 27 August 2007 21:31
tom-le-termite has offerd to translate this into french.
      
tom-le-termite
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Mon, 27 August 2007 22:24
Done. Razz

If an offical DoW (from the french part) see any issue in my translation, just let me know.
      
Henning K
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Tue, 28 August 2007 00:39
I will translate this into German tomorrow morning, great work and thanks to ColtsFan 76!

Henning Kröpke
      
DarkPadawan
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Tue, 28 August 2007 09:48
Great work, guys. CF, will this information be included into something like an ongoing FAQ- sheet? Or will it be made sticky to find it faster?

Dark.
      
ColtsFan76
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Tue, 28 August 2007 13:35
DarkPadawan wrote on Tue, 28 August 2007 02:48

Great work, guys. CF, will this information be included into something like an ongoing FAQ- sheet? Or will it be made sticky to find it faster?

Dark.

Henning requested that the admins make it sticky. I have no plans to do any BL FAQ since I think you or someone over at Battleloremaster.com is handling that - plus there are the official compendiums. So I am not looking to step on anyone's toes that may already be compiling any answers. My only goal is to catch the stuff that has been left open (usually buried because of all the community contributions) and get it answered.

On the memoir side, I will get the FAQ completed.

[Updated on: Tue, 28 August 2007 22:34]

      
echtalion
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Tue, 28 August 2007 20:35
And I would translate this into Spanish were there a Spanish forum... Rolling Eyes
      
germ
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Wed, 29 August 2007 15:54
So far, we've got a creatures compendium, and a lore card compendium. Maybe we could produce a Unit compendium? A terrain compendium? It might go faster for people to find the answers they're looking for rather than searching the forums. I dunno, it's just an idea...
      
ColtsFan76
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Wed, 29 August 2007 16:11
germ wrote on Wed, 29 August 2007 08:54

So far, we've got a creatures compendium, and a lore card compendium. Maybe we could produce a Unit compendium? A terrain compendium? It might go faster for people to find the answers they're looking for rather than searching the forums. I dunno, it's just an idea...

I believe that is the goal, along with a Command Card compendium. Problem is, DOW just has too much going on right now and so it is hard for them to fall back and get these things going.

Do your best to search for an answer but if you have trouble, just post. Someone will gladly answer - even if it has been asked before!
      
SquarePegIX
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Fri, 07 September 2007 22:38
Um...not to open a can of worms or anything, but what exactly is "the HR/RR/FF debate"? Confused

- IX
      
Zeal
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Fri, 07 September 2007 22:42
SquarePegIX wrote on Fri, 07 September 2007 14:38

Um...not to open a can of worms or anything, but what exactly is "the HR/RR/FF debate"? Confused

- IX


*sob*


      
Zeal
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Fri, 07 September 2007 22:49
Sorry about that. I've pulled it together now. Twisted Evil

*pushes everyone else back*

I've got it...I said I've got it!!!

Back off!

Sorry about that, SquarePeg. Here, these threads should get you started. Judge for yourself.

http://www.daysofwonder.com/en/msg/?goto=97407

http://www.daysofwonder.com/en/msg/?goto=102798

http://www.daysofwonder.com/en/msg/?goto=95483

http://www.daysofwonder.com/en/msg/?goto=92499

http://www.daysofwonder.com/en/msg/?goto=92430

Best,

Zeal

[Updated on: Fri, 07 September 2007 22:51]

      
SquarePegIX
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Fri, 07 September 2007 23:02
Ah yes, now I am reminded. I just couldn't for the life of me figure out what HR/FF/RR meant in the initial post. Thank you.

- IX
      
Roobarb
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Sat, 08 September 2007 19:35
i have question Exclamation can you use the cta deploment cards in an all human way ala 100 years war exp Question
      
yangtze
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Sat, 08 September 2007 21:56
The suggestion has been field the human equivalent where you get Gobbos and Dwarves coming up on CtA cards. If there are none available, use levy tokens.
      
Roobarb
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Sun, 09 September 2007 14:12
yangtze wrote on Sat, 08 September 2007 20:56

The suggestion has been field the human equivalent where you get Gobbos and Dwarves coming up on CtA cards. If there are none available, use levy tokens.



er nice one yangtze but wont that give the standard side an advantage over the pennant side Question Confused has anyone game tested this Question

[Updated on: Sun, 09 September 2007 14:13]

      
ColtsFan76
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Sun, 09 September 2007 14:35
Roobarb wrote on Sun, 09 September 2007 07:12

yangtze wrote on Sat, 08 September 2007 20:56

The suggestion has been field the human equivalent where you get Gobbos and Dwarves coming up on CtA cards. If there are none available, use levy tokens.



er nice one yangtze but wont that give the standard side an advantage over the pennant side Question Confused has anyone game tested this Question

Maybe a slight advantage. The Standard side has goblins and most have 5 units per card instead of the typical 4. But yuo might be able to offset this by allowing the pennant side to place a 3rd reservist.

But I am not even sure this is necessary. Having a couple more units on the board doesn't necessarily give you the advantage. In M44, having more units meant you just had more medals to offer your opponent most times. BL is a bit different since there are more cards that offer orders to more units at once. But I still don't think it is enough to unbalance it too terrible much.
      
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Sun, 09 September 2007 14:49
thanks guys Very Happy the reason im asking is that im thinking of makeing a campain set in 100 years period where goblins and the like are from a parllel dimnesion called the otherworld so you may only get yer gobblins ect ta certan points on the campain map..ie where the space between this world and the other are weak Razz
      
Zeal
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Wed, 12 September 2007 17:09
Coltsfan, is there going to be another q&a soon?
      
ColtsFan76
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Wed, 12 September 2007 21:21
Zeal wrote on Wed, 12 September 2007 10:09

Coltsfan, is there going to be another q&a soon?

I actually went through last night and tried to gather up the open questions from here and BGG.

I was going to ask Eric within the next couple of days when he wanted the next one. Our "agreement" was that it wouldn't be on a fixed schedule but I would attempt to gather up questions about 2 weeks after the last round of answers. It just so happened that everyone's schedules converged last time so that they were able to get the answers back in lightening-fast time.

Not that BL fans care, but I was hoping to hold off until the Air Pack rules were posted for M44 so I could send both in at the same time. But both games have a decent chunk of questions already.
      
Zeal
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Wed, 12 September 2007 21:35
ColtsFan76 wrote on Wed, 12 September 2007 13:21

Zeal wrote on Wed, 12 September 2007 10:09

Coltsfan, is there going to be another q&a soon?

I actually went through last night and tried to gather up the open questions from here and BGG.

I was going to ask Eric within the next couple of days when he wanted the next one. Our "agreement" was that it wouldn't be on a fixed schedule but I would attempt to gather up questions about 2 weeks after the last round of answers. It just so happened that everyone's schedules converged last time so that they were able to get the answers back in lightening-fast time.

Not that BL fans care, but I was hoping to hold off until the Air Pack rules were posted for M44 so I could send both in at the same time. But both games have a decent chunk of questions already.


Currently, my only question is how many more products for battlelore can we resonably expect before year's end. 1, 3? Not sure if this in in the vein of what you were collecting.

Z

      
ColtsFan76
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Wed, 12 September 2007 21:42
Zeal wrote on Wed, 12 September 2007 14:35

Currently, my only question is how many more products for battlelore can we resonably expect before year's end. 1, 3? Not sure if this in in the vein of what you were collecting.

Z



Also as part of our "agreement" I am allowed to ask (these types of questions) but if they don't want to answer, they don't have to and I won't hound them. Mostly because they are still holding to the "we'll announce when we can guarantee delivery" guideline to avoid the carry case debacle again.

So, yes, I have you covered already just no guarantees! Wink
      
Zeal
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Wed, 12 September 2007 21:46
ColtsFan76 wrote on Wed, 12 September 2007 13:42

Zeal wrote on Wed, 12 September 2007 14:35

Currently, my only question is how many more products for battlelore can we resonably expect before year's end. 1, 3? Not sure if this in in the vein of what you were collecting.

Z



Also as part of our "agreement" I am allowed to ask (these types of questions) but if they don't want to answer, they don't have to and I won't hound them. Mostly because they are still holding to the "we'll announce when we can guarantee delivery" guideline to avoid the carry case debacle again.

So, yes, I have you covered already just no guarantees! Wink



Thanks! Just planning ahead for budgeting, in case something else BESIDES Shocked Battlelore catches my eye.
      
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Wed, 12 September 2007 21:49
i have another question Exclamation with out useing the specialist cards or exps what are the minunim number of base set units you need to make the feudal levy tokens null'n'void Question
      
ColtsFan76
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Wed, 12 September 2007 21:55
Roobarb wrote on Wed, 12 September 2007 14:49

i have another question Exclamation with out useing the specialist cards or exps what are the minunim number of base set units you need to make the feudal levy tokens null'n'void Question


More than 1 and less than 2.

1 Base set has enough to cover exactly 1 deployment deck from each camp. So if you played all 7 cards from 1 deck of each camp, you would use all your figures from 1 base set.

But when you mix 2 decks, then you run the risk of fielding duplicates of the rarer units. There is a chance you won't (since you are only drawing 4 of the 14 cards) but a likelihood of at least some of the levy tokens will be needed.

So while you do not need a full second base set, the only way to guarantee no tokens is to have the 2nd set.
      
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Fri, 14 September 2007 19:09
ColtsFan76 wrote on Wed, 12 September 2007 20:55

Roobarb wrote on Wed, 12 September 2007 14:49

i have another question Exclamation with out useing the specialist cards or exps what are the minunim number of base set units you need to make the feudal levy tokens null'n'void Question


More than 1 and less than 2.

1 Base set has enough to cover exactly 1 deployment deck from each camp. So if you played all 7 cards from 1 deck of each camp, you would use all your figures from 1 base set.

But when you mix 2 decks, then you run the risk of fielding duplicates of the rarer units. There is a chance you won't (since you are only drawing 4 of the 14 cards) but a likelihood of at least some of the levy tokens will be needed.

So while you do not need a full second base set, the only way to guarantee no tokens is to have the 2nd set.


er thanks for the replie but im looking for numbers you see im in the middle of painting ive desided to go for 2 base sets and i whant to make 2 sides a red (english) and a blue (french)side and the remaider of the units are going to be generic althow saying that i might just avoied organised play Confused
      
ColtsFan76
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Fri, 14 September 2007 19:52
Ah, in that case, you will have to give me until this weekend to be more specific. I did an "inventory" of the cards to see what each deck would give me. But it appears that spreadsheet is on my home laptop and not my work laptop.

But it is hard to nail down the exact number of units you would need to cover all possibilities of units. I can give you some general stuff now but actual deck limits might be different.

Each card has 4 to 5 units on it. Most units that have 5 units typically have a Goblin unit on them. I don't think there is ever more than 2 of the same unit type present on the same card (EDIT: a couple cards from each camp have 3 of one unit). So a card typically gives you 3 to 4 different units.

Let's say you are using 5 cards (if playing Epic) - that is your scout, 3 guards, and your reserve. Typically, you are going to have no more than 1 of each unit type on a card. If all 5 of your cards have the same unit, then you will need at least 5 units of every type to accomodate every possibility.

These are the exceptions:
*Green Archers - Pennant: 3 cards have 2 archers each. So it is possible to draw up 8 Archer units. (Standard does not have the same ratio)

*Blue Horses - Pennant: 1 card has 2 so it would be possible to draw 5 units. Standard: 2 cards have 2 so it would be possible to draw 7 units.

*Goblin Lizard - Pennant: 2 cards have 2 so it would be possible to draw 7 Goblin Lizards

*Red Swordsmen - Standard: 1 card with 2 so a max of 6 units. (Pennant has none)

*Blue Goblin Foot - Pennant: 1 card with 2 so a max of 6 units
*Blue Dwarven Foot - Standard: 2 cards with 2 so a max of 7 units

*Blue human foot - Pennant: 2 cards with 3, 3 cards with 2 equals 12 potential units. Standard - ditto.

Now, this is the theoretical. What needs to be done is to check against what is actually printed on the cards. For example. Red Swordsmen - Standard can theoretically go to 6 units. But when you look at the cards, no Standard Deploment deck shows more than 2 Red swordsmen units (which is what the base game gives you). But if you combine any 2 decks, your potential now goes up to 4 is you happen to pull every card that has a red swordsman on it. So while your theoretical max was 6, your actual max is 4 and your statistical max - well someone else needs to calculate that!

So let me look at the hard data I have at home, and run some numbers. I will give you a complete list of the maximum number of each unit type you can field.

      
Roobarb
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Fri, 14 September 2007 20:19
nice one Very Happy take in to acount that each side will have a complete set of goblins and dwarfs Razz so i guess it only the humans to worry about ..right Question

[Updated on: Fri, 14 September 2007 20:23]

      
ColtsFan76
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Sat, 15 September 2007 08:34
Alright Roob, this is just for you.

This is my logic. The first column (if I get this formating to work) is the number of units that are called for in a single 7-card deployment deck. It also transaltes into the number of figures that should have come in your base set. So if you split your base set up into these ratios, you could paint one set one color scheme to represent the English/Pennant/Lion Head side and the other set the French/Standard/Fleur-de-lis side. This will leave you with no spare figures though.

The next two columns are what you were asking for. The thought process is that in Organized mood, you may take up to two decks to form your deployment deck. In the rare event that you draw all the cards that contain the most of one unit, you would need X amount of units. So what I did was break down each card and sorted them by how many of each figure type appeared on a card and in what quantity. I then took the two decks that would give me the most of that unit.

In a standard game, you draw 4 cards (3 guards and 1 reserve) so the most you can play off of is 4 cards. In an Epic game, you get to add the scouts so there are 5 cards that you use during deployment. So in some cases, you will need 1 or 2 more figures do the possibility of pulling more cards in Epic. However, most unit types are represented on no more than 4 cards, so in that case, the regular game and the epic game have the same limits.

Finally, since you wanted to split the figures up into one camp or the other, I ONLY took the combinations of the Pennant on one side and the Standards on the other. I did not mix and match. However, since each side has some specific tendancies, I don't *think* that combining a Standard deck with a Pennant deck will alter these results. As a point of information, I included the deck combo as a reference when it made a difference.

Without further ado, here is your list:

Pennant			Base	Normal	Epic	Combo	|	Adds	Specialist Card
Human	Green 	Archer	4	6	7	Any	|	+1	IT
Human	Green 	Foot	2	4	4	Any	|	+1	IT
Human	Blue	Foot	9	10	12	A/C	|	+1	IT
Human	Red	Foot	2	4	4	Any	|	+1	IT
Human	Blue	Mounted	3	5	6	A/Any	|	+1	IT
Human	Red	Mounted	2	4	4	Any	|	+1	IT
Goblin	Green 	Archer	1	2	2	Any	|	+2 / +2	GM, IT
Goblin	Green 	Foot	2	4	4	Any	|	+2 / +2	GM, IT
Goblin	Blue	Foot	2	4	4	B/Any	|	+2 / +2	GM, IT
Goblin	Red	Foot	1	2	2	Any	|	+2 / +2	GM, IT
Goblin	Green 	Mounted	2	4	4	B/C	|	+1	IT
		Creature	1	2	2	Any	|	-	-
									
Standard			Base	Normal	Epic	Combo	|	Adds	Specialist Card
Human	Green 	Archer	4	4	5	Any	|	+1	IT
Human	Green 	Foot	2	4	4	Any	|	+1	IT
Human	Blue	Foot	9	10	12	A/B	|	+1	IT
Human	Red	Foot	2	4	4	A/Any	|	+1	IT
Human	Blue	Mounted	3	6	6	B/C	|	+1	IT
Human	Red	Mounted	2	4	4	Any	|	+1	IT
Dwarven	Green 	Crossbow	1	2	2	Any	|	+1	IT
Dwarven	Blue	Foot	3	6	6	Any	|	+2 / +2	DM, IT
Dwarven	Red	Foot	1	2	2	Any	|	+2 / +2	DM, IT
		Creature	1	2	2	Any	|	-	-

Note 1: DM=Dwarven Mercenaries; GM=Goblinoid Mercenaries; IT=Imaginary Troops; 
Note 2: King's Allies would increase all unit counts by 1 figure (+0.25 units for foot and 
+0.33 units for mounted) by itself or by 2 figures if used before IT (+0.50 units for foot 
and +0.67 units for mounted)


Couple other comments. As I suspected, it looks like in most cases, the most you will need in any given category is usually twice the number of actual figures you have in one base game. (Which goes back to just getting 2 base sets and paint one in one color scheme and the other in a different scheme and put half of each back in each game. See how much work I could have saved myself if I just made you listen to me in the first place!)

I included the Goblins and Dwarves in case you did want to do two color schemes. Reason being is there are a couple scenarios where there is a civil war and one race is on both sides.

EDIT: I wanted to take a look at the Specialist Cards as well. Only 4 cards effect troops in the base game. The vast majority of Specialist cards proved the unique sculpts found in the expansion packs (and most expansions include the exact number of units you need to feild the troops called from the specialist cards - so in context of the painting, you really can't split these up into camps as either side could recruit them. If you wanted distinct armies, you would need 2 sets of each expansion). About a half-dozen cards do not effect troop quantity at all.

With that, I added the last two columns to the chart. This would be the number of units you would based on the play of the specialist cards played in the right-mist column. Of course, now you are getting beyond the number of units provided in two games, so you may have to pick something else if you get in thes "best-case scenarios."

Let me know if there is anything else you want to look at.

[Updated on: Sat, 15 September 2007 15:45]

      
Roobarb
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Re:Q&A with DOW - August 24-27 2007 Sat, 15 September 2007 13:57
Cool nice one mate ...its gonna take me a few days to fully absorbe this infomation Very Happy but it is most aprecheated or in words i can spell thank you very much for all youer work Razz Wink
      
    
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