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Helcat
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Brigadier

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Re:Brigadier Bar Wed, 25 January 2012 03:14
Quote:


Yeah, but If I give you the first slice who will I serve the second slice to?


I am really looking forward to a second General, not in the least because I am quite fed up with the Police playing.


Quote:


Hopefully you will get company from someone soon, but it would not be nice to let a whole cake go to waste. So have a cupcake first: Hers is a nice one with a brigadier bar on top. Whipped cream with that? Smile


Thank you, I love whipped cream. If it is whipped with a whip I would even more enjoy it.

[Updated on: Thu, 26 January 2012 02:00]

      
gheintze
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Re:Brigadier Bar Wed, 25 January 2012 15:24
As far as I can tell, the last expert battle Helcat played before his promotion was Operation Konrad vs. chriscoub.

This was his 10th victory as the Allies on the Eastern Front, but he only had 9 as the Axis, so 10 wins on each side cannot be the magic number.

However, it was the 6th unique Eastern Front battle he played, and he already had more than 6 in all the other Fronts.

So, my current theory was that you need to play 6 unique battles on every Front.

However, I now realize that I've played over 6 unique battles on each front. Maybe you need to win a certain number of unique battles on each front, but I don't have the time to go through his record to that extent...

There is probably a total wins or plays requirement as well, but Helcat would have been far above any of those already.

Geoff

      
JFKoski
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Advanced Historian

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DON'T DELETE EXPERT SCENARIOS Wed, 25 January 2012 21:18
I went to look at my spreadsheet of expert scenarios and found some missing.

When they added new scenarios this month (Gold Beach, Operation Goodwood, Carentan Causeway and Utah Beach,) I deleted my expert scenarios for the first three. Now my data for Gold Beach is lost. (Goodwood and Causeway suck so bad I didn't want to play them more than one match each with my buddy). I have Gold saved on my computer with the scenario ID# but can't save it under that ID online any more.

Since expert scenarios are the thing for Brigadier promotion, I'm thinking we might not get credit for games played from deleted scenarios. So I want to apologize to those who played Gold Beach in Expert mode either with me or when I had it up in Sept-Oct.

I reported the error message I got when I tried to save it. This may require a thread of its own depending on their response.

[Updated on: Wed, 25 January 2012 21:38]

      
Phread
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Re:Brigadier Bar Wed, 25 January 2012 21:29
SFTF scenarios come and go. I think as long as you played them they will count.

I have played many SFTF scenarios where the owner/creator has replaced them with a different scenario.

It would be very difficult - probably impossible - to gain promotion with SFTF scenarios that had to be available at the time.

Analyse Brigadier Helcat's SFTF battle results. They include SFTF scenarios that weren't available when he was promoted.

[Updated on: Wed, 25 January 2012 21:31]

      
gheintze
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Re:Brigadier Bar Wed, 25 January 2012 22:50
Well, I now have wins at six unique scenarios from each front from one side or the other.

I'll have to do some more analysis...

Geoff
      
gheintze
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Re:Brigadier Bar Wed, 25 January 2012 23:14
So I've looked at my record. But first I have to say that the number of variables to get promoted is reaching a very high number. It's impossible (in my mind) to analyze everything to figure this out...

We've got fronts, sides, playing against different ranks, expert games, unique battles, solo expert games (are we sure they don't count?), designed games...

It's going to be hard to figure...

In any case,

Axis
Eastern 5-3
Western 8-4
Mediterranean 4-7
Pacific 4-5
Total 21-19

Allies
Eastern 7-2
Western 5-7
Mediterranean 8-4
Pacific 5-3
Total 25-16

Total 46-35 in 81 games played. These are expert games (not solo).

I've made sure to win every official battle again as a Colonel and have many wins and plays, I'm sure. I didn't analyze those as it seems the expert battles are the ones that will matter.

On each Front, I've played the following several unique battles: 7 Meditteranean, 7 Eastern, 6 Western, and 9 Pacific.

As far as unique wins (win of a specific side in different battles) -

Axis
Mediterranean - 5
Eastern - 6
Western - 5
Pacific - 5

Allies
Mediterranean - 3 (there are only 3 mediterranian scenarios up right now)
Eastern - 5
Western - 6
Pacific - 4

I really have no idea how to proceed with a purpose. I guess I'll just keep playing expert scenarios and play official ones every once in a while to see if I've hit the magic numbers...

If I can find the time, I'll try to do the same for Helcat and some other players, but it will be much more difficult with the amount of expert battles they've played. If anyone else has the time to figure it out and post them, I'm sure that we would all be appreciative... Cool

Geoff

[Updated on: Wed, 25 January 2012 23:16]

      
stevens
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Omaha Victory

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Re:Brigadier Bar Wed, 25 January 2012 23:22
I think you need 500 expert games under your belt.
      
gheintze
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Re:Brigadier Bar Wed, 25 January 2012 23:33
stevens wrote on Wed, 25 January 2012 17:22

I think you need 500 expert games under your belt.


Wow, that will take a bit of time...

That seems to be an onerous burden considering that expert wasn't supposed to count for promotions or awards.

Geoff
      
Phread
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Re:Brigadier Bar Wed, 25 January 2012 23:52
stevens wrote on Thu, 26 January 2012 11:22

I think you need 500 expert games under your belt.


Sir I think you are wrong.

The required number is IMHO much much less than that.

The answer isn't hard to find in an analysis of Brigadier Helcat's SFTF wins as Colonel.

I am working my way towards those requirements.
      
gheintze
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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 00:13
No Message Body

[Updated on: Thu, 26 January 2012 00:37]

      
Phread
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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 01:02
gheintze wrote on Thu, 26 January 2012 12:13


Message Body
[Updated on: Thu, 26 January 2012 12:37]




Did you run out of things to say? Shocked Laughing Shocked Laughing Shocked
      
gheintze
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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 01:03
Phread wrote on Wed, 25 January 2012 19:02

gheintze wrote on Thu, 26 January 2012 12:13


Message Body
[Updated on: Thu, 26 January 2012 12:37]




Did you run out of things to say? Shocked Laughing Shocked Laughing Shocked


No, I thought better of what I said...
      
toddcalu
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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 04:56
gheintze wrote on Wed, 25 January 2012 16:03

Phread wrote on Wed, 25 January 2012 19:02

gheintze wrote on Thu, 26 January 2012 12:13


Message Body
[Updated on: Thu, 26 January 2012 12:37]




Did you run out of things to say? Shocked Laughing Shocked Laughing Shocked


No, I thought better of what I said...


Yeah, I thought it too. Confused
      
Phread
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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 10:47
I am sorry that people, gheintze especially, are unhappy that I won't share my theory about what is needed to be promoted to Brigadier. I have been wrong before and I want to confirm my theory before it is revealed.

Everyone please accept my apology.

If I am correct then when I am promoted it will be obivious what the requirement is.
      
rasmussen81
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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 10:57
Phread wrote on Thu, 26 January 2012 13:47

I am sorry that people, gheintze especially, are unhappy that I won't share my theory about what is needed to be promoted to Brigadier. I have been wrong before and I want to confirm my theory before it is revealed.

Everyone please accept my apology.

If I am correct then when I am promoted it will be obivious what the requirement is.


I think the confusion and frustrating isn't that you're afraid you might be wrong...it's that up until now the promotion system has been a collaborative effort.

By telling people that you have a theory, but not sharing it, you are making it into a competition. In the future, it might be a good idea to keep your theories to yourself if you aren't willing to share. Rolling Eyes
      
gheintze
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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 13:24
rasmussen81 wrote on Thu, 26 January 2012 04:57

Phread wrote on Thu, 26 January 2012 13:47

I am sorry that people, gheintze especially, are unhappy that I won't share my theory about what is needed to be promoted to Brigadier. I have been wrong before and I want to confirm my theory before it is revealed.

Everyone please accept my apology.

If I am correct then when I am promoted it will be obivious what the requirement is.


I think the confusion and frustrating isn't that you're afraid you might be wrong...it's that up until now the promotion system has been a collaborative effort.

By telling people that you have a theory, but not sharing it, you are making it into a competition. In the future, it might be a good idea to keep your theories to yourself if you aren't willing to share. Rolling Eyes


Exactly...You have thanked me for my theories for the Colonel promotion, which I appreciate. However, it's hard to believe that you are really grateful when you are unwilling to reciprocate now that we're working on Brig. General.

Geoff
      
Helcat
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Brigadier

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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 20:13
Thank you all for your visit here. I seriously enjoy your company and admire the quests you undertake to get here. If I can be of any help to take a permanent seat in this bar, please let me know, because I seriously like to have some more company.

Bartender fill the glasses and put up some new music.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22QYriWAF-U

Helcat
      
Nygaard
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Général de brigade

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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 21:40
Should we grab a drink, Helcat?

I'll let out the others so we can talk grown-up business Smile
      
Quit2
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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 21:47
Congrats general Nygaard.

Someone else who played alot of expert already. I'm convinced that expert is the key.
Other people have been colonel longer, and have been winning all scenarios for a x-th time, but the two generals are the colonels I see playing expert most.

Now if we would only know how much we need and if there is a distribution over fronts and sides.
      
Phread
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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 21:48
Gentlemen and Gentlewoment, as you are unhappy that I won't reveal my untested theory I will not comment any further in this thread until such time as I can confirm or deny my theory.

This also means I wil no longer comment when I think someone s barking up the wrong tree.

I am genuinely sorry to have annoyed/frustrated/angered all or any of you. Once more accept my apology which is sincerely offered.

BTW Congratulations to Général de brigade Nygaard the second player to reach the new rank.

Perhaps someone (else) would compare the careers of the two Brigadiers and reveal the secret.

[Updated on: Thu, 26 January 2012 21:53]

      
Helcat
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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 22:00
Nygaard, Welcome my friend.

Bartender,

Champagne, Fill the glasses.

and put up some new music.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wsdy_rct6uo

Which Spin Doctor told you how to get here?

Welcome and tell your tale.
      
stevens
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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 22:01
Congrats Nygaard! Hip Hip Hooray!!!!
      
silenttimo
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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 22:12
Congrats Nygaard !


Well Helcat, are you feeling less lonely in the Generals' club now ?
Cool


(I guess quite soon other players like Gheintze, Phread and a few others wil join you)

[Updated on: Thu, 26 January 2012 22:22]

      
Helcat
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Brigadier

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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 22:13
Phread wrote on Thu, 26 January 2012 21:48

Gentlemen and Gentlewoment, as you are unhappy that I won't reveal my untested theory I will not comment any further in this thread until such time as I can confirm or deny my theory.

This also means I wil no longer comment when I think someone s barking up the wrong tree.

I am genuinely sorry to have annoyed/frustrated/angered all or any of you. Once more accept my apology which is sincerely offered.

BTW Congratulations to Général de brigade Nygaard the second player to reach the new rank.

Perhaps someone (else) would compare the careers of the two Brigadiers and reveal the secret.




Hi Phread,

As you are a free man you are free to either post your theory online or do not do that. In my perception you are not offending when you choose not to reveal your theory. I wish you good luck in reaching the Brigadier status.

KR Helcat
      
Pete Repete
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Colonel

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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 22:56
Congrats General Nygaard - the world that is ours is now a safer place with you in the Brigadier bar... Laughing

So drink up dear sirs - but leave some for the next ones Smile
      
Nygaard
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Général de brigade

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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 23:07
Helcat wrote on Thu, 26 January 2012 22:00

Nygaard, Welcome my friend.

Bartender,

Champagne, Fill the glasses.

and put up some new music.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wsdy_rct6uo

Which Spin Doctor told you how to get here?

Welcome and tell your tale.


Thank you, General.

Well - it was just after a long and hard fight with a great lion on a beach near a lighthouse, I felt I needed a change of scenary, and the cold stretches of Russia sounded like just what the doctor ordered.
Here I fought and won a hard battle around Rhez against the German Wehrmacht - which finally caught the eyes of the brass in Paris.

Smile

How about a refill? Let me get that glass for you, general.
Oh, and let me just put on a new excellent music number...



      
Jokull
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Brigadier General

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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 23:53
http://youtu.be/5mC1P3AMj7k
      
stevie02
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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 23:54
Well done Helcat and now Magnus. 2 of the most deserving promotions there has ever been. Whilst the majority of us were chasing awards and rank with the official senarios these two were playing 'senarios from the front' for the pure enjoyment of it, with no thought to collecting bawbles, glassbeads or pats on the back. Well done, I salute both of you.

Stevie
      
Jokull
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Re:Brigadier Bar Thu, 26 January 2012 23:54
So is the great secret

Every Expert Mission from Every side against a human opponent?

Congrats

J
      
Phread
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Re:Brigadier Bar Fri, 27 January 2012 00:04
Hello Everyone.

I have had time to examine Nygaard's SFTF results as Colonel.

His results disprove my theory about what it takes for promotion. Shocked Shocked Shocked

This is why I didn't reveal it because I was wrong - for a second time. Rolling Eyes Confused Embarassed Confused Rolling Eyes

If I had told you my theory I would have mislead you.

Regards Phread.
      
Jeronimon
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Re:Brigadier Bar Fri, 27 January 2012 00:15
Congratulations to Magnus!

Dear sirs as you are now with two I feel it is time to offer slices of the small cake. I feel you would be able to eat it whole before it turns bad. Razz

The large cake will have to wait untill some more have joined your exulted ranks.
(Can I say "oh high and might ones"? Or would that be too much?)

Very Happy
      
Mr_Simon
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Michael Wittmann

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Re:Brigadier Bar Fri, 27 January 2012 00:29
Reading all the posts on the forum, I understand that the expert mode could be the key.

But how do you explain that the two General have been moved up playing a regular one (Rzhev and Gold Beach).

It certainly involves requirements on the standard scenario like a minimum of games played and winned like the colonel during promotion requirement

I expected to compare the carreer of the two Generals and all their games after their promotion as a colonel. But I can't find the date when it happened. It seems to have disappeared.

http://www.daysofwonder.com/memoir44-online/fr/officer/roste r/?rank=COL#backtolist

Maybe someone can tell me when they've been promoted Colonel in order to upgrade my files and try to match the links between theses two players after this passing the colonel step.

Another question to the community. They've been promoted in Rzhev et Gold Beach, 2 scenarios that didn't exist when the colonel extension was opened. We didn't need to play Rzhev and others like Tunisia, Montélimard, etc.. (Gold didn't exist at thoses times). Does it mean that we need to play and win theses recent (more or less) scenarios in the General quest and as the opposite we don't need to win again all the old ones with both side.

Mr_Simon


      
Helcat
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Re:Brigadier Bar Fri, 27 January 2012 01:24
Mr_Simon wrote on Fri, 27 January 2012 00:29

Reading all the posts on the forum, I understand that the expert mode could be the key.


I guess that as well

Quote:


But how do you explain that the two General have been moved up playing a regular one (Rzhev and Gold Beach).



My guess is that the software calculating and/or triggering promotion is executed only on normal maps.

Quote:


It certainly involves requirements on the standard scenario like a minimum of games played and winned like the colonel during promotion requirement



I think there is a minimum number of games to be won, however I do not think normal battles are required after becoming a Colonel

Quote:


I expected to compare the carreer of the two Generals and all their games after their promotion as a colonel. But I can't find the date when it happened. It seems to have disappeared.
http://www.daysofwonder.com/memoir44-online/fr/officer/roste r/?rank=COL#backtolist



From an IT system perspective there is probably only one rank record attributed to a user.

Quote:


Maybe someone can tell me when they've been promoted Colonel in order to upgrade my files and try to match the links between theses two players after this passing the colonel step.



Earlier in this thread you can find my promotion dates, Nygaards dates you will have to find by scrolling through his officer career. Unless he posts them here.


Quote:


Another question to the community. They've been promoted in Rzhev et Gold Beach, 2 scenarios that didn't exist when the colonel extension was opened. We didn't need to play Rzhev and others like Tunisia, Montélimard, etc.. (Gold didn't exist at thoses times). Does it mean that we need to play and win theses recent (more or less) scenarios in the General quest and as the opposite we don't need to win again all the old ones with both side.



As far as I see it you don't need to play games, but you want to. (-;
My guess is no, as far as I see I did not win the old ones again both sides being a Colonel.

Off course I might be wrong.



[Updated on: Fri, 27 January 2012 01:43]

      
gheintze
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Brigadier General

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Re:Brigadier Bar Fri, 27 January 2012 02:05
stevie02 wrote on Thu, 26 January 2012 17:54

Well done Helcat and now Magnus. 2 of the most deserving promotions there has ever been. Whilst the majority of us were chasing awards and rank with the official senarios these two were playing 'senarios from the front' for the pure enjoyment of it, with no thought to collecting bawbles, glassbeads or pats on the back. Well done, I salute both of you.

Stevie


I couldn't have said it better myself... Congrats, Magnus!!!! Well done!

Well deserved. I look forward to playing you soon!

Geoff
      
hdescavernes
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Michael Wittmann

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Re:Brigadier Bar Fri, 27 January 2012 02:19
gheintze écrit le Fri, 27 January 2012 02:05

stevie02 wrote on Thu, 26 January 2012 17:54

Well done Helcat and now Magnus. 2 of the most deserving promotions there has ever been. Whilst the majority of us were chasing awards and rank with the official senarios these two were playing 'senarios from the front' for the pure enjoyment of it, with no thought to collecting bawbles, glassbeads or pats on the back. Well done, I salute both of you.

Stevie


I couldn't have said it better myself... Congrats, Magnus!!!! Well done!

Well deserved. I look forward to playing you soon!

Geoff


Like he would say so himself : QFT ! Very Happy

Congrats Magnus

[Updated on: Fri, 27 January 2012 02:20]

      
Phread
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Re:Brigadier Bar Fri, 27 January 2012 02:31
Given that you want me to share my thoughts - here they are.

There is a factor missing which I have not discovered.

At the point at which Helcat and Nygaard were promoted I had better statistics (wrt to number of wins) in results in the standard scenarios than Helcat, and better results in SFTF scenarios (against real opponents) than Nygaard (comparing our careers as Colonels).

What else?

1) Both Nygaard and Helcat were ranked in the top 100 when promoted. I am not (at the moment).

2) I have only published 1 SFTF scenario, Helcat and Nygaard have published more.

As 2) is more difficult to achieve I may concentrate on 1) for a day or two.
      
gheintze
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Re:Brigadier Bar Fri, 27 January 2012 02:48
Phread wrote on Thu, 26 January 2012 20:31

Given that you want me to share my thoughts - here they are.

There is a factor missing which I have not discovered.

At the point at which Helcat and Nygaard were promoted I had better statistics (wrt to number of wins) in results in the standard scenarios than Helcat, and better results in SFTF scenarios (against real opponents) than Nygaard (comparing our careers as Colonels).

What else?

1) Both Nygaard and Helcat were ranked in the top 100 when promoted. I am not (at the moment).

2) I have only published 1 SFTF scenario, Helcat and Nygaard have published more.

As 2) is more difficult to achieve I may concentrate on 1) for a day or two.


Hmmm, good thoughts. I don't think that the rankings could matter, as that depends on the standard scenarios... and DoW has expressed its concerns about the ranking system.

I hope that it's not designing scenarios -- the quality of the scenarios will quickly drop if people are publishing them just to get promoted.

Geoff
      
gheintze
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Re:Brigadier Bar Fri, 27 January 2012 06:37
I downloaded and combined the spreadsheets of Helcat, Nygaard, and Jokull (I figured he must be pretty close) and looked for the similarities.

I'll skip ahead to the conclusion -- I have no idea what the requirement is for promotion...

Here are the details. I first figured out their last expert battles before being promoted, as well as their first expert battles after being promoted to Colonel (in case it is not cumulative). I also dropped all the solo games and the games with no data anymore.

Then I figured out how many wins they each have by side and front -- both total and only after colonel.

The results:
Helcat

Entire Career:
Eastern: Allies 15-5; Axis 9-6
Mediterranean: Allies 12-7; Axis 11-6
Pacific: Allies 18-15; Axis 18-14
Western: Allies 25-11; Axis 28-14
Total: Allies 70-38; Axis 66-40
Overall 136-78

Colonel only:
Eastern: Allies 10-4; Axis 9-2
Mediterranean: Allies 5-6; Axis 7-4
Pacific: Allies 13-7; Axis 10-9
Western: Allies 20-10; Axis 23-13
Total: Allies 48-27; Axis 49-28
Overall 97-55

The last expert battle before promotion (and the only one in between regular online battles, so it must be the triggering battle) was a victory as the Allies on the Eastern front (Operation Konrad).

Nygaard

Entire Career:
Eastern: Allies 10-4; Axis 4-11
Mediterranean: Allies 8-4; Axis 6-5
Pacific: Allies 89-77; Axis 91-59
Western: Allies 14-8; Axis 11-13
Total: Allies 121-99; Axis 112-88
Overall 233-187

Colonel only:
Eastern: Allies 8-3; Axis 2-8
Mediterranean: Allies 7-3; Axis 5-5
Pacific: Allies 16-13; Axis 19-11
Western: Allies 10-4; Axis 4-12
Total: Allies 41-21; Axis 4-12
Overall 71-69

The last expert battles for promotion were four battles on the Pacific front (1-1 as the Axis and 1-1 as the Allies).

I honestly can't see any parallels between these two records. Perhaps there is some trigger in the official battles that one of them hit as well. In any case, I have a lot of expert battles to play and win -- so I hope you are all ready for me. Very Happy

Geoff

BTW, Jokull already has 110 expert victories as a Colonel, and 123 overall -- so he may be next... Wink

[Updated on: Fri, 27 January 2012 08:13]

      
gheintze
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Brigadier General

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Re:Brigadier Bar Fri, 27 January 2012 08:10
Wow, it's 2AM and I'm still analyzing the data of our two Brigadier Generals...

As it turns out, I've found something. When analyzing the expert records of their entire careers, I found that Helcat as won 71 different victories and Nygaard has won 70 different victories. This is a close enough number considering that I was counting and totalling manually.

I define "different victories" as winning as the Axis and Allies at different battles. So winning as Axis at the Battle of the Tennis court and winning as the Allies at the Battle of the tennis court would count as two different victories, but subsequent victories at the same battle do not count.

I hope I've explained that adequately.

I haven't gone back to check their records only as a Colonel, but this means play and win lots of different battles.

I'm at 41 by the way... Smile

Geoff
      
Jeronimon
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Brigadier

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Re:Brigadier Bar Fri, 27 January 2012 08:31
Thanks for sharing Phread and Gheintze.

Since we know DoW has a preference for round numbers might I speculate you need say 50 victories in distinct different expert battles (as explained by Gheintze) as a Colonel. I will investigate this, but as I have played little expert battles and am a very fresh Colonel I expect more experienced Colonels will go before me. Mad Very Happy

As with the rank of Lt Col there still might be some otter mystery requierement that we still have to figure out. Happy intelligence gathering gentlemen! (I have yet to encounter the first female officer.) Smile
      
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