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red_zebra
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  Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Tue, 18 July 2006 00:16
A lot of us would like some British units:

I think with them we could get scenarios for France 40, 8th Army, South East Asia, with Commonwealth units against the Germans and Japanese.

I would vote for this expansion to be a dependent expansion, meaning that you will need to have Terrain and Pacific Theater, as we will have all the badges and most of the special rules, that way we will have more room for scenarios. Very Happy

Maybe add some more desert / Jungle tiles

I think the Matilda II tank would better represent the British armored: they fought in France40, in the Desert and against the Japanese. (I do love cruiser tanks)

And of course some 25pdr as artillery.

just hoping here Cool

[Updated on: Tue, 18 July 2006 00:32]

      
Brummbar44
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Tue, 18 July 2006 01:11
the Perrin 25 pdrs. are awesome...these should definitely be the guns in a set!

http://www.brummbar44.com/slides/06_25pdr.jpg

[Updated on: Tue, 18 July 2006 02:05]

      
Nordiskanc
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Tue, 18 July 2006 02:02
I'll second it.
      
Brycie35
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Tue, 18 July 2006 04:35
I would like to have British units too.
I would buy any expansion with these units!
      
yangtze
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Tue, 18 July 2006 09:31
Count me in!
      
ColtsFan76
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Tue, 18 July 2006 13:59
of course, count me in for 2
      
Marc91
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Tue, 18 July 2006 16:59
I'd buy it. But I also think they should make a French Army
      
tank commander
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Wed, 19 July 2006 00:34
Marc91 wrote on Tue, 18 July 2006 10:59

I'd buy it. But I also think they should make a French Army


Why bother -- they will just surrender Very Happy

[Updated on: Wed, 19 July 2006 00:34]

      
ColtsFan76
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Wed, 19 July 2006 00:42
tank commander wrote on Tue, 18 July 2006 17:34

Marc91 wrote on Tue, 18 July 2006 10:59

I'd buy it. But I also think they should make a French Army


Why bother -- they will just surrender Very Happy


I was thinking the same thing. Smile

I'd much rather see the Italians before the French.
      
Brummbar44
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Wed, 19 July 2006 00:46
You guys do realise this is a Franco-American game?

Besides, I think there is a strong case to be made for the French figs. By this I mean the French resistance (who didn't surrender). They would be probably one of the easiest to expand figures wise...they would only need infantry.

Of course, I think the British forces should be next in line...perhaps with a proper Desert send up scenarios and all.

I do like the idea of Italian forces too though!

[Updated on: Wed, 19 July 2006 00:47]

      
Nordiskanc
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Wed, 19 July 2006 01:53
heck, if they make the 6th expansion dependant on having the terrain pack, possibly the desert board, the expansion could just be miniatures for both the British and Italians, several scenarios, a few badges. Basically 2 sets of miniatures and no terrain. Very Happy
      
red_zebra
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Wed, 19 July 2006 02:51
That would mean only desert scenarios, no France 40 Sad (could always leave that for a French expansion Very Happy ) and no South East Asia against the Japanese! Crying or Very Sad Crying or Very Sad
      
Sarge77
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Wed, 19 July 2006 02:59
[quote title=Brummbar wrote on Tue, 18 July 2006 15:46]You guys do realise this is a Franco-American game? (so?) Rolling Eyes

Besides, I think there is a strong case to be made for the French figs. By this I mean the French resistance (who didn't surrender).


They couldnt surrender as the Nazi's would execute them being part of the "resistance." You don't have a "resistance" unless your country has been beaten or has surrendered.But Germany was just too strong. France did what she could.

If it wasn't for the French in the Revolutionary War, America might not be here today.
      
Brummbar44
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Wed, 19 July 2006 04:20
Sarge77 wrote on Tue, 18 July 2006 17:59

Brummbar wrote on Tue, 18 July 2006 15:46

You guys do realise this is a Franco-American game?
(so?) Rolling Eyes


So...there are plenty of French players...try being a little more sensitive.


Brummbar wrote on Tue, 18 July 2006 15:46

Besides, I think there is a strong case to be made for the French figs. By this I mean the French resistance (who didn't surrender).


Sarge77 wrote on Tue, 18 July 2006 17:59

They couldnt surrender as the Nazi's would execute them being part of the "resistance."


They didn't have to take up arms and risk their lives either....but they did.
      
coyote58
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Wed, 19 July 2006 09:40
Nice answer Brummbar !

If there is a british expansion, you'll need a lot of badges for every country of the Commonwealth and a special rule like:

- every "x" turns the British player change de nationality of his troops Laughing Laughing

I just think of that because i'm quite confuse when i try to follow a british army in some book (then the canadian are under order of the australian, who are relieve by the indian under new-zealand command, etc... Very Happy
      
Scragnoth
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Wed, 19 July 2006 10:02
Having another set of figures would only add to "the feel" of the game, rather then taking the game forward as a whole.

I would rather like to see some progress in the carying case with the planes and for example a board that has no fixed edges on the upper and lower side so you can make larger scenario's with a 4x4 board. Maybe you could add other ideas.

I do see that visualization of the game is important but not so much as enhancing this wonderfull game.
      
red_zebra
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Wed, 19 July 2006 14:53
Well, Italians did surrender too, and . . . do not want to derail this thread.

I choose to vouch for the Commonwealth in expansion 6, even when I would love more of "France" in the game, only because the case for the French is more difficult:

France 39-40, really France 40, as nothing really happened during the << Drôle de guerre >> : a couple of month of furious and desperate battles, and the Alps defence against the Italians

How many scenarios?

The battle of Sainte-Menehould, the De Gaulle counter attack, the Weygand line defence, something in the Alps, rear guard action at Dunkerque, maybe some action in Narvik. . .

French infantry in french uniforms, similar to WWI
Somua S-35 tanks (leave the Char B to grognards that want special tanks for the elite units. . . like me Razz )
The 75mm gun

Then, the "Forces Françaises Libres" get equipped by the British, and fight with them against Vichy government in Syrie (french equipment) and latter against the Germans and Italians: Bir Hakeim

After operation Torch, the French African troops fought alongside the Allies using the french uniform for the last time

After that, the french forces got american equipment . . .

      
Boddekker
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Wed, 19 July 2006 15:14
I'm such an M44 junkie that I'd pick up a set of Brits, or whomever, as well. Just so long as they all fit in the One Box to Rule Them All.
      
PaleKing
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Fri, 21 July 2006 13:05
I would like to see an expansion for the British, but specifically so as to make use of the Desert board more. It seems that there is a great opportunity to expand the game into the whole North Africa theatre. There are some great scenarios to play out in that region and the expansion could include various tanks and half-track vehicles.

At the moment the desert board has one scenario and hardly any terrain. it seems to me that its just begging to be utilised more.

Alternatively - I'd love to see a new sea-scape board and a change in scale. The mechanics of the game could work for destroyers, subs, planes and aircraft carriers, with terrain hexes illustrating islands, reefs, mined areas etc. A new deck of cards would need to be written, but it could be great fun.
      
Jayne Starlancer
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Fri, 21 July 2006 17:26
Quote:

Alternatively - I'd love to see a new sea-scape board and a change in scale. The mechanics of the game could work for destroyers, subs, planes and aircraft carriers, with terrain hexes illustrating islands, reefs, mined areas etc. A new deck of cards would need to be written, but it could be great fun.


That would be a whole new game, not just an expansion.

I as well would love to get more use out of the Desert side of my Winter/Desert Board... and those Blitz rules.
      
GreatDane
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Thu, 10 August 2006 19:44
British units would be great!

Brummbär wrote on Wed, 19 July 2006 00:46

I think there is a strong case to be made for the French figs. By this I mean the French resistance (who didn't surrender). They would be probably one of the easiest to expand figures wise...they would only need infantry.


Not that easy!
They were not uniformly clothed...
Cool
      
tank commander
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Thu, 10 August 2006 22:25
Ah ,the French, they fight AFTER they surrender!! Shocked
      
Sniper
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Thu, 10 August 2006 23:56
Count me in, I have made numerous pleas/hints for a North African/Med expansion that includes British Mini's.
      
GhostWolf69
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Fri, 11 August 2006 11:08
I would definetly buy a Brit-expansion if there was one. Heck I know friends of mine (Serious Anglophiles I might add) who simply refuse to play the game becuase there are no real gentlemen to command. Cool

(Don't shoot the messenger)

/wolf

[Updated on: Fri, 11 August 2006 11:09]

      
oddball
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Fri, 11 August 2006 16:41
Count me in for a British expansion, or any other for that matter. Keep 'em coming and I'll keep buyin'. Very Happy
      
D-Day Dawson
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Fri, 11 August 2006 17:10
I, too would be interested in a British/Commonwealth expansion.

Perhaps French figures, or more accurately French Resistance figures, could feature in an expansion detailing the activities of resistance/guerilla groups throughout the conflict - such as the Partisans in Yugoslavia, for example?
      
tank commander
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Fri, 11 August 2006 22:34
If these is an expansion for the Brits, these remains one question -- perhaps it should be put to a vote. What tank should be selected to represent them? One of the above posts suggested the Matilda.

The British tank program was a bit complicated. Seems that they could not decide on one model.

Whereas the Germans had the Mk IV, the Russians the T-34 and the Americans the Sherman, the Brits had numerous models. Even the Italians settled on the M13/40. I do not count the Japanese as armor was not a main consideration in their operations (not w/o reason though).

So I submit the following for anyone wishing to vote on which model should do the honors.

(Model / years made / # made)

1) Matilda / 38-43 / 2900+

2) Crusader / 39-43 / 5700

3) Cromwell / 42-44 / 3400

4) Valentine / 39-44 / 6800

5) Churchill / 41-45 / 5600

By sheer numbers, the Valentine leads the pack. It also was in service for most of the war AND produced every year of the war except 1945. So, I think I would cast my vote for that model.
      
Kevlar56
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Sat, 12 August 2006 03:19
I would DEFINITELY by a British expansion!! The tank should be a Crusader. This was the tank that drove Rommel out of Africa AND the main battle tank used by the British from D-Day through Market-Garden. (I'm not sure, however, how many made it to the India-Burma theatre).
Artillery should be the 26 pounder.
Infantry should probably reflect Commonwealth troops.

What I would like to see as an additional expansion (after that) would be a "special forces" expansion, including (in a neutral color, maybe?), Partisans, Ski Troops, Cavalry, Snipers, etc...
OR...
An alternate colored expansion (perhaps pale greenish-blue?) that could be used for French, Italian, Commonwealth, Minor Axis or other nations in combined scenarios with the previously issued expansions. I like the idea of actually have models on the board as opposed to 'markers'.
Think of it, you could do many scenarios with the above, combined British/French vs. Axis scenarios, Vichy/German vs. the America 'Torch' landings, Aussie/Americans in the Southwest Pacific theatre, 'Wacht am Rhein' scenarios splitting the Americans and British forces, Soviet forces splitting the Germans/Minor Axis at Stalingrad,etc...
OR...
You could use the alternate/neutral color/special forces figs for scenarios like the Warsaw Uprising, Partisan attacks behind enemy lines, the German paradrop at Liege, the invasion of Norway, the list goes on and on.
Yes, you could use the current figures to 'represent' any of the Allied or Axis nations, but I would MUCH rather have appropriate figures to see and play with than have to keep checking cardboard markers to see who is who or what is what.
To borrow a phrase from a friend of mine...
Just my two cents.
      
coyote58
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Sat, 12 August 2006 09:15
If DoW start to do different figs for different nation (but i really don't think they will go in that), I only hope they'll make it in a special box without any scenario or new rules.

One of the thing i like with M44 is that you can play with two basic army quite cute enough to feel what they represent, without wasting a lot of money in figs (like warhammer).

Just my opinion, i understand guys who want to have more realistics figs, it's just not my kind of stuff. So it would bother me a lot to have to buy a lot of figs to get only a few new rules. You now can guess that my best expansion is the terrain pack ! Very Happy Rules, hex, no figs...
      
GreatDane
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Sat, 12 August 2006 15:48
coyote58 wrote on Sat, 12 August 2006 09:15

If DoW start to do different figs for different nation (but i really don't think they will go in that)


Well - that is what they have been doing so far.
I believe you mean 'different figures for the same nations'
Razz

Quote:

I only hope they'll make it in a special box without any scenario or new rules.


I am with you on that one.
As much as I like the idea of a special carrying case for the game I doubt I will find it useful as I have two sets of everything and don't want to carry TWO cases around.

But because they intend to include special rules I might end up having to buy at least one just to get the bonuses...
Crying or Very Sad
      
red_zebra
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Sat, 12 August 2006 17:40
I started this thread asking for a Matilda tank, but after reading "tank commander&#8221; post, and some research in Wikipedia, I will cast my vote for the Valentine Tank. Smile

Even the Russians used them
      
RonB
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Sat, 12 August 2006 20:02
Kevlar 56,
The Crusader was phased out after North Africa. The only versions used in NW Europe in '44 were the AA version and as prime mover for the 17 pdr., and at that only in very limited numbers. I've never heard of any going to the CBI theater.

A large proportion of those Valentines you list were manufactured in Canada and were shipped to Russia. There were very few gun Valentines, although some bridgelayers, in NW Europe. Some in Italy. Some were used by the Kiwi's and Aussies in the Pacific. They also used the Matilda II in gun tank and flame thrower versions.

Th most prominent tank of British production in NW Europe in 44 had to be either the Cromwell or the Churchill. So, as far as representing British made armour, one of these is best. Later, the Comet made an appearance in small numbers in the 11th AD at the end of the war, but saw limited service.

By far the tank most often used by the Brits in '44 was the Sherman. How 'bout a Sherman Firefly?
      
Brummbar44
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Sat, 12 August 2006 21:59
Perhaps a factor that needs to be considered from a manufacturing standpoint is the fact that if DoW would stay with Perrin minis (which I don't see why they wouldn't) then the options available become limited.

Sherman III Fire Fly
Valentine Mk I - Mk IX

Of course, they might consider making a tank specifically for the game but these are currently the options.
      
coyote58
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Sun, 13 August 2006 08:26
GreatDane écrit le Sat, 12 August 2006 09:48

coyote58 wrote on Sat, 12 August 2006 09:15

If DoW start to do different figs for different nation (but i really don't think they will go in that)


Well - that is what they have been doing so far.
I believe you mean 'different figures for the same nations'
Razz



could be my english not good enough Confused

What i mean is that DoW isn't doing "at large" figs like warhammer, axis and allies mini, and other games of that kind, where you need to by a lot of package of figs to play. Sorry for the misunderstanding Very Happy
      
Mr & Mrs Guderian
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Mon, 14 August 2006 02:00
Dear All,

I've been away from the forum for a bit, for real-world stuff - turning up for work, paying bills, that sort of thing. Boring stuff.

I have wanted to get some British Soldiers together for some time. I researched it but couldn't quite get the right plastic figures. Either the colour was wrong, or they didn't look quite right, or the base was the wrong shape. The nostalgia bit is important.

You can get Germans anywhere (although I don't think you can beat Airfix), but anyone else is a problem. Especially if you want them all exactly the same with square bases.

So I wrote the following to Days Of Wonder:

Quote:

Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2006 11:28 PM
Subject: Memoir '44 - British Infantry Figure Packs


Dear Days of Wonder,

I've been playing Memoir '44 and have bought all the Expansions except the Pacific one (yet). I live in the UK.

Since playing this game the one thing that seems to be missing is some British Infantry. I was hoping that you might have plans to produce packs of 42 unpainted, Early War British Soldiers in Khaki with plain Tin Helmets, Packs and SMLE Lee-Enfield Rifles, in the same firing pose as the American GI you use.

Definately the Lee-Enfield as it was used all the way from the Sudan (1895) to Korea (1956) and was most representative of the British Army for decades. I don't think that the Bren Gun or Sten Gun have quite the same attachment.

I know that Axis & Allies made very pale figures, and a lot of sets are Dark Brown, but its not the same. When I was young everything was Airfix - Germans were Dark Grey, Americans were Dark Green and British were Khaki. So I think that the unpainted colour is very important.

I think that Esci (then Italeri) did some good examples:
http://www.plasticsoldierreview.com/Review.asp?manu=ESC& code=200

The drawback of buying these is that in order to get all the same figure you might need to get 7 packs of figures which could be very costly. Also they do not have the square bases needed to play the game.

Seeing as we were the only ones to last from one end of the war to the other, apart from the Germans, that there might be some justification for producing some Infantry. More importantly, many of the scenarios feature the British and its a shame that they aren't represented with the right sort of figures.

I think that if Memoir is to continue expanding then some figure packs would be a good idea. There are always the Afrika Korps, 8th Army, better Tanks or Artillery, Infantry Support Weapons, various Paratroopers and Commando's, maybe even some French, etc, but I would really like to ask for some British Infantry in Khaki!

I look forward to your reply.



So the reply came back (in a reasonable and considerate time, I might add):

Quote:

Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 2:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Ticket#2006071410000011] Memoir '44 - British Infantry Figure Packs


Thank you for your message.

I agree some British soldiers would be great. We do not have plans for an African or Burma expansion for the moment, but you never know. In any case, I kept your message for further reference.

Thank you for your support of Memoir '44 !



Which, of course, was very disappointing. I am not sure how the North Africa/Burma reference entered into it, but never mind. I think that if more people emailed Days of Wonder, it might seem to them as more of a viable proposition to them. I am quite sure that they read the forums, but I think that sending emails shows more interest than speaking amongst ourselves.

On the other issues in this thread - Definately the 25 pdr's for Artillery! I would go with either the Churchill or the Cromwell for Tanks. The Churchill served the longest, just in different marks, and it sounds more WW2. The Cromwell was at least comparable to contemporary designs like the T-34 and Sherman. Then there was the Matilda from the Desert. The other British Tanks were notoriously awfull. Actually, correct that - they were all awfull. At least there were plenty of Shermans. They weren't quite as awfull.

If anyone wants to know more about British Tanks, then read "Death By Design" by Peter Beale. The title says it all.

Mostly, I'm in it for the Infantry, though. In the right colour, with the right rifle, and the right tin-hat, and a back-pack. Just like at Dunkirk, etc. Not to mention the films. Anyone see A Bridge Too Far, recently?

Anyway, what would Churchill say if he was told that there couldn't be British Soldiers? He'd probably get arguementative and do something about it. Oh, and look sulky untill he got his way.
      
red_zebra
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Tue, 15 August 2006 00:51
Need a sulky smilie
      
tank commander
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Tue, 15 August 2006 01:12
text in bold from an earlier post:

"I would go with either the Churchill or the Cromwell for Tanks. The Churchill served the longest, just in different marks, and it sounds more WW2. The Cromwell was at least comparable to contemporary designs like the T-34 and Sherman. Then there was the Matilda from the Desert. The other British Tanks were notoriously awfull. Actually, correct that - they were all awfull. At least there were plenty of Shermans. They weren't quite as awfull."


The Churchill is not a bad choice. But in if the Perrin minis are used (as brought up in an earlier post) as the basis for a Brit tank then there are only 2 options: Sherman Firefly or the Valentine.

Someone suggested the Firefly, but I would much prefer a British tank in spite of how terrible they may have been.

Also, British Sherman equipped units were not made up solely of Fireflys. There were just not enough to go around due to the shortage of the 17pdr. Using this tank would be akin to having the Russian T 34/85 instead of the T-34/76.

[Updated on: Wed, 16 August 2006 15:03]

      
*player38092
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Tue, 15 August 2006 11:24
Marc91 écrit le Tue, 18 July 2006 16:59

I'd buy it. But I also think they should make a French Army
They should.
The French did fight well on many occasions and suffered losses comparable (and even worse) than WW1s heavy slaughters.
They lost the war due to global strategical errors and due to lack of reaction (they easily could have stopped the German panzers at the Meuse crossings, if they had moved quickly enough - Guderian was very positive about this), rather than by lack of valour.
Of course, facing overwhelming aerial superiority and Pnazerdivisions made some reserve units loose heart and surrender. But one mustn't think the French didn't resist and surrendered easily.
Battles at Stonne, Arras or Saumur showed that the French could offer some serious resistance against the Germans, given means to act...
The French lost hundreds of thousands of men, which means they tried to fight somehow.
And having the French would offer interesting scenarios, with Vichy forces fighting the Americans in Morocco, in november 1942 (it lasted about two or three weeks before the French African forces sided with the Allies).
Note that the British, in 1940, did not offer so much a better resistance than the French. It was not a question of valour, but of being caught in a clever trap set by the Germans.
The Italians, however, broke their teeth against the French defenses in the Alps, in 1940 and they fought a much less massive war in Africa, than the French in France and Belgium - and over there, already, they were smashed by the British untill the German came to help them. Sicily put an end to their military capacities.
      
kazin
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Thu, 17 August 2006 15:41
I'd like to add my support to the idea of the British as a separate army.

As for the colour, that's a bit more tricky. Some kind of tan in between the colours of the japanese tan-yellow and the russian brown perhaps?
      
steelyvoid
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Re:Another plea for the British as expansion 6 Thu, 17 August 2006 19:05
tank commander wrote on Fri, 11 August 2006 16:34

So I submit the following for anyone wishing to vote on which model should do the honors.

(Model / years made / # made)

1) Matilda / 38-43 / 2900+

2) Crusader / 39-43 / 5700

3) Cromwell / 42-44 / 3400

4) Valentine / 39-44 / 6800

5) Churchill / 41-45 / 5600



I vote 1). I've always been a fan of Matildas since playing them in Crescendo of Doom, in which they bestride the 1940 battlefield like an early-war Tiger (when the 2pr was an AT weapon to be scared of!)

I think the Matilda therefore marks a high point of British tank design (compared with contemporary wartime nations) and so should be chosen to represent them in the expansion.
      
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