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Caboose
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What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 10:24
As a fun little thread, I was wondering what people would like to see for Battlelore. Maybe there is something that you are hoping that BL would implement and it is such a GREAT idea, everyone else would want it too. That is what this thread will try to do..

The only restrictions would be that it cannot be possible creatures (unless it is the basis of other items) and also must be relevant to the Battlelore gaming system/theme. That is it.

I myself am hoping there would be more races to come like elves or some other humanoid races (skeletons, zombies, orcs to name a few). Of course, I would like to see these new races TIE into the overall BL story, just not another race for someone to play. And since most "fantasy" elves live in forests, they probably would be better archers. Thus maybe they get to roll an EXTRA dice for range based warface BUT wouldn't do MORE damage than a human (i.e. Green elf archer would roll 3 dice, but could only do at most 2 damage).

Also I would like to see more rules for campaign scenarios. Something like that if one wins like 3 scenarios, maybe my goblins are less frightened (i.e. only run 1 square back vs 2) but still have goblin panic. Or maybe have the ability to combine like troops (i.e. 2 blue infantry are at like 1 and 2 units left in their units..combine it to form ONE blue infantry with 3 units in it). Items like that to form some basis for campaign scenarios (i.e base groundwork).

There are probably other items I would like to see, but it's late and my brain wants some sleep..either that or my eyes. Hopefully others might add and maybe there might be an idea or 2 that really would be nice to see.

Cab
      
Maimed
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 13:40
Hi Cab,

I also play C&C ( can I say that here?) and they have , "light troops" that can retreat before combat flags,and swords dont count only the Helmit with the proper color counting. They only have shore range attacks 2 Hexes.


A berserker unit, with lots of dise, may 6 dice , be will be hit normal attacks for unity type plus on Flags( Berserkes do NOT retreat)

Cheers
Mike
      
toddrew
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 13:43
Caboose wrote on Mon, 24 December 2007 02:24

Or maybe have the ability to combine like troops (i.e. 2 blue infantry are at like 1 and 2 units left in their units..combine it to form ONE blue infantry with 3 units in it).


Ooh, a command card similar to "Rally" in C&C:A, except what it would allow one to do is combine existing units and removing the now extra banners from play (kinda like evading leaders off the board in C&C:A). Have the number of dice rolled be tied to the command (in a very real sense be connected to the level of one's commander) and for each color rolled that type of weakened unit may be ordered and allowed to join with any other weakened unit to make an up to original strength of the now bolstered unit, which can this turn attack at +1d but make no further movement. Lore would be wild, allowing for any weakened unit to be ordered thusly.

So, yeah, Command and Lore card expansions would be something I would look forward too Smile
      
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 13:56
Spieler390699 wrote on Mon, 24 December 2007 05:40


I also play C&C ( can I say that here?) and they have , "light troops" that can retreat before combat flags,and swords dont count only the Helmit with the proper color counting. They only have shore range attacks 2 Hexes.


Well, if C&C:A cannot be mentioned here, I am going to be guilty of a lot of such infractions Wink (As I am in the opposite vein, talking about BL all the time while playing C&C:A Very Happy ) The Goblin Slingers are just such a unit, and I expect there will be more like them. I'm sure BL-centric players saw slingers for the first time and thought "how useless" and C&C:A-centric players thought "finally" Laughing EDIT: though if the slingers also had the ability to evade in the same sense that units in C&C:A did, then they would be even that much better.


Quote:

A berserker unit, with lots of dise, may 6 dice , be will be hit normal attacks for unity type plus on Flags( Berserkes do NOT retreat)



I fully expect to see a unit with similar capabilities before too long.

[Mis à jour le: Mon, 24 December 2007 13:58]

      
Maimed
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 14:06
Knights on hore and on foot.
Knights being brave are all bold Twisted Evil

1. Heavy Lanz armed Cav with a +1 D when attacking, and are bold.

2. dismounted Knights( the did that often enough so it must have been good) ignore the first Sword against them and they are bold.

Cheers
Mike
      
Maimed
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 14:14
Human pesants.

Are all fearful , they move only one hex, are green and the standard does not counts towards victory! The are just cannon fodder, but eat up commands Twisted Evil

Chears
Mike
      
pomakli
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 14:14
Hello Mike!

Spieler390699 schrieb

Knights on hore and on foot.


They are in the coming extension included!

see below:
http://www.asmodee.com/jeux-de-societe/news/news.htm?HK=a608 b3f18d63fc7609b7567b5e3706a3&ID=853

Best wishes!

Pomakli
      
pomakli
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 14:17
Hello Mike!

Spieler390699 schrieb


1. Heavy Lanz armed Cav with a +1 D when attacking, and are bold.



We discussed about it also in the German forum and Bladefight_14 made a very good suggestion.

Even, wenn they are in the defensive, then they should lose 1 dice!

Best wishes!

Pomakli
      
pomakli
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 14:24
Hello!

Spieler390699 schrieb


dismounted Knights ignore the first Sword against them and they are bold.


is a very good idea.

But I think, that they will appear in form of "Characters or Heroes", if you consider, that we have "Heavy Infantry"!

Rolling Eyes

Best wishes!

Pomakli
      
Captain Kremmen
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 15:08
1st - Creatures such as Ogres/Trolls etc.

2nd - Introduce the evade rule from CCA, particularly for green cavalry

3rd - Leaders, or in battlelore terms i presume heroes?

AFTER these things are done then a new faction would be nice. Personally I love the undead...

Andy
      
jscheck
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 16:11
Personally, what I would look forward to the most would be a new lore master or new lore cards for the existing four.
      
On High
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 16:37
1) A point based system for building armies and balanced scenarios.

2) Online scenarios that utilize combinations of the different specialist packs.
      
DarkoBeta
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 17:39
Maybe some animals that can be summoned/controlled? It would be kind of fun to have a pack of wolves in your army...
      
Caboose
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 18:37
Well I guess you could say C&C, but also if BL becomes too much like C&C, then why have a game that is so close to it, right ? Hope you can see what I'm trying to get at...what would make Battlelore better and stand out. I know people want more creatures, but I suspect there will be more, just not as fast as we the customers would like it to be...and thus why I wanted that item to be out of the equation.

Basically I was looking for items that would be very nice to have plus add "value"/uniqueness to the game itself.

As for other people's comments/suggestions (Everyone's so far, have been great - not knocking anyone's ideas/comments, they are probably all good, but some might need to be elaborated on, so everyone can see the bigger picture of your idea. Thus if you do have something new, do try to elaborate on what you might want to do.) :

Spieler390699 :
1) " Knights on hore and on foot." - I sure hope that is a typo and you meant HORSE. Otherwise we might be getting into something that yes, it was in medieval but also DoW needs to sell the game as a family game as well, if you know what I mean. (And if you don't get what I'm talking about, then you probably are too young to understand).
2) Barbarian unit - I do like the "concept" but 6 dice seems a tad extreme, since it would have to be perhaps a red unit and then it would move very slow. Maybe you can expand on it to see where you might be trying to go on it?!?
3) C&C light troops - Not familiar with C&C so can you enlighten us here. Although I'm hoping for "new" original ideas, if there is something that would help BL, then I'm all for it. Thus more info please (for those that are not C&C enthusiasts, so everyone is on equal footing).
4) Human peasants - May I ask what is the intent for them ? I'm not seeing how they would be benefit. Not trying to knock your idea Mike, I'm just not seeing the usefulness of them.

Todd :
Rally command card - As much as it seems that card would probably be great to have, my gut tells me that DoW probably will stick with it's base command set, since most of the command cards are similiar (for the most part) between M44 and BL.

Captain Kremmen :
1) Evade rule - again, since some of us are not C&C people, please elaborate as much as you can on how this is used and/or background for it.
2) As I stated initially, let's try to leave the creatures out unless there is a purpose for it (i.e. tie in with some other idea), since as I stated, I know everyone would like to have more creatures, with everyone probably having their own version of which one they would want, etc.
3) Heroes - yes I agree, I wish it did get released, but at least we know we will get such a release. So better to hope than none at all!
4) Factions - to elaborate on your thread, I myself would like to hopefully get some background info as to why the Dwarfs and Goblins hate each other (since most of the base scenarios have them usually on 1 side or the other - very rarely on both). Thus maybe DoW can expand on the Battlelore World History and explain what has transpired and thus give some background info on the respective races.
5) Undead faction - As for your undead faction, I myself would think that if DoW sticks with the "humanoid" type undead (and leave the non humanoid to maybe be a creature and/or hero), that probably be best (of course that is just my opinion). Since everyone who is a fantasy junkie can probably list of quite a bit of undead. Was thinking more along the lines of skeleton/mummy as a base undead.
But also like you, I think we should get more of the background items (heroes, history of the BL world, other items like campaigns) fleshed out before we get more races. I hate for a race to be introduced and see it have no bearing in the overall picture.

jscheck
Additional Lore masters/cards - Maybe you have some ideas as to what type of cards and/or additonal lore masters. Are you maybe also thinking of saying that maybe there can be at most 4 lore masters (for this discussion, I'm talking about the 4 that are part of the W/C - Wizard, Cleric, Rogue and Warrior). And thus maybe people can decide which one's make up the W/C and thus those are the only 4 that can be part of the W/C for that scenario ?

If that is what you are thinking (for lore masters), maybe you might have some idea as for what other lore masters you would like to see ?!? If so, do elaborate and hopefully you can think of 15 lore cards for it (even if they might duplicate some that are already, since we do have some masters who take from others).

As you can see JS, I do like that idea - didn't even think of something like that. That is why these forums are great, what one person thinks of can turn into a great idea.

Also see DarkoBeta idea as well and see if that might work too (plus see my comment/suggestion there too).

On High
1) Point based systems - See Silverwing's blog posting - here is the thread :

http://www.daysofwonder.com/en/msg/?th=13360&start=0

and see if that is what you might be thinking of. Of course that probably is a start and I bet you probably had something a little different in mind. Again, do elaborate.
2) Scenarios w/ other expansions - Well you can create some and that would be one way. Remember that usually each DoW expansion, the scenarios are trying to use the new units and thus trying hard not to use the other expansions. But yeah it would be nice to see a combination of expansions in a scneario..of course one that is balanced with each side have a equal chance of winning.

DarkoBeta :
Animals - After seeing jscheck idea, maybe you 2 can combine idea here of having a Lore Master who's lore cards summon animals and/or additional troops. Would have to be some not so powerful ones (so it won't tip the balance). If so, I would think one would have to balance things out - maybe via allowing only a person to cast such a card every X turns or using the #/type of troops on the board at the time, etc etc. You probably get the idea here and hopefully run with it.

Definitely keep the ideas coming folks...each one has been great and maybe some of these might see the light of day..who knows, right ?

Cab
      
jscheck
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 19:04
Well, I don't really have any ideas for new cards. For a fifth lore master, however, I was thinking something along the lines of terrain manipulation. For example, there might be a 'Heavy Downpour' card which transforms one or two hexes into marshes, a 'Forest Fire' card which would take forest hexes off the board, or a 'Cut Canal' card which allows you to place, say, three water hexes branching off in a line from a preexisting river.
I haven't thought about it in great detail but that's the general idea.
      
Captain Kremmen
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 20:26
Sorry!

Ib C&CA light troops may evade this gives them two advantages. Only one of which is really relevant for battlelore so i will mention that one.

They can declare an evade whenever attacked in close combat. This means they automatically retreat 2 hexes and the attacker may not follow up pursue, or attack any 2nd unit. Very useful this. The downside is that the attacker still rolls the normal number of attack dice and only gets hits on the correct colour. You ignore lore, flags, shields etc, just the colour so a 1 in 6 chance per dice of inflicting damage. This allows light troops to get close to an enemy but still get out of trouble.

In C&CA this skill applies to many troops. In Battlelore I would make it just green mounted units (not the spider) and some lighter green infantry units. Units such as crossbow and longbow are really a touch "heavy" to run away, but units like light goblin sllingers would be suitable
      
Caboose
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 20:41
Captain Kremmen wrote on Mon, 24 December 2007 12:26

Sorry!

Ib C&CA light troops may evade this gives them two advantages. Only one of which is really relevant for battlelore so i will mention that one.

They can declare an evade whenever attacked in close combat. This means they automatically retreat 2 hexes and the attacker may not follow up pursue, or attack any 2nd unit. Very useful this. The downside is that the attacker still rolls the normal number of attack dice and only gets hits on the correct colour. You ignore lore, flags, shields etc, just the colour so a 1 in 6 chance per dice of inflicting damage. This allows light troops to get close to an enemy but still get out of trouble.

In C&CA this skill applies to many troops. In Battlelore I would make it just green mounted units (not the spider) and some lighter green infantry units. Units such as crossbow and longbow are really a touch "heavy" to run away, but units like light goblin sllingers would be suitable


Captain, could you give an example or 2 so I can follow what you are saying above...

Thanks
Cab
      
Caboose
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 20:43
jscheck wrote on Mon, 24 December 2007 11:04

Well, I don't really have any ideas for new cards. For a fifth lore master, however, I was thinking something along the lines of terrain manipulation. For example, there might be a 'Heavy Downpour' card which transforms one or two hexes into marshes, a 'Forest Fire' card which would take forest hexes off the board, or a 'Cut Canal' card which allows you to place, say, three water hexes branching off in a line from a preexisting river.
I haven't thought about it in great detail but that's the general idea.


JS, well all great ideas have to start somewhere, so hopefully you can put some thought to it and maybe it can be a reality. I know it's the holidays and all (and of course this is a "fun" topic as well).

And I know it always bring great satisfaction when you can say "I made that!"

Cab
      
William Lange
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 20:58
I didn't take the time to read the whole thread so somebody else may have already come up with this. The following is my idea for Battlelore Heroes:

When you make your War Council you choose one 'hero' to put in you guest slot. You only put one level on him, just like creatures. The 'hero' then is assigned a section of the battlefield to work in (Note: he does not actually go on the board. He just is said to "be there" with a card or something similar to the way you place your guards in CtA.) On your turn, in addition to playing command cards, you may also spend 'hero tokens' to activate one of your hero's abilities. These abilities could range from: moving to a different section of the battlefield, to inspiring a squad, to casting a localized spell. The player would earn these hero tokens by having certain things happen in the section containing the hero, like, killing an enemy squad, battling back, or pursuing the enemy with cavalry. Furthermore, units in a section with a hero would gain ceratain bonuses (i.e. Mounted units in a section with a mounted hero could move one space further on a pursuit action.) Finally, you can never kill a hero. You may only be more powerful. I suppose you could add lore cards that would enable 'assassinations' but that wouldn't be entirely neccessary.

Kudos to you if you read all that AND understood it. Very Happy If you have any questions please post them, and I can clarify.
      
AK_Aramis
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 23:04
I want elves.
Hobbits and undead would be nice, too.

Oh, and more creatures.

[Mis à jour le: Mon, 24 December 2007 23:06]

      
Caboose
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Mon, 24 December 2007 23:24
William Lange wrote on Mon, 24 December 2007 12:58

I didn't take the time to read the whole thread so somebody else may have already come up with this. The following is my idea for Battlelore Heroes:

When you make your War Council you choose one 'hero' to put in you guest slot. You only put one level on him, just like creatures. The 'hero' then is assigned a section of the battlefield to work in (Note: he does not actually go on the board. He just is said to "be there" with a card or something similar to the way you place your guards in CtA.) On your turn, in addition to playing command cards, you may also spend 'hero tokens' to activate one of your hero's abilities. These abilities could range from: moving to a different section of the battlefield, to inspiring a squad, to casting a localized spell. The player would earn these hero tokens by having certain things happen in the section containing the hero, like, killing an enemy squad, battling back, or pursuing the enemy with cavalry. Furthermore, units in a section with a hero would gain ceratain bonuses (i.e. Mounted units in a section with a mounted hero could move one space further on a pursuit action.) Finally, you can never kill a hero. You may only be more powerful. I suppose you could add lore cards that would enable 'assassinations' but that wouldn't be entirely neccessary.




William, nope no one went into the depth like you did.

As for the WC, I suspect the 1 level would be like the creature, it would be part of the cost of setting up the WC.

In regards to hero tokens, I'm hoping you might have some better ideas on how one can obtain these hero tokens?!? Even though I do see you say one can get them via killing a unit, it would seem to make the hero less weaker, since one might spend quite a few tokens early on and then have very few before he/she might get a first kill.

Maybe is if one has placed the hero in the middle, every time you play a command and/or lore card that targets the middle, you get hero token. And this only applies on your turn, never the opponents.

Also maybe make it possible to maybe kill a hero, but it would take some doing. Maybe like a creature, but it has more hits and thus longer to kill maybe ?? Also since the hero is "hidden" that in itself would make it tougher to kill as well. With a hero being somewhat powerful, maybe the hero should only be ever at one section at any one time ?!?! (can fudge on that, but something to think about)

I kinda like the localized spell aspect, but maybe for starters, let's keep it simple and remove the local spell aspect out of the picture initially (i.e. since other items might open a can of worms..thus let's keep it out of the picture initially) And then add it to the mix once the other items come to fruitation.

How many heroes are you thinking of..4 to 6 ? How does one select a hero - random or like specialist cards and be able to pick and choose what is available - i.e. no duplicates?? Would the heroes be race and/or unit specific (i.e. archers, mounted, etc) or not at all (i.e. human but helps everyone, be it human or goblin).

Hope that gets some things going on that...Cab
      
William Lange
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Tue, 25 December 2007 01:41
Yeah, Cab I like the ideas of starting with a couple tokens, and the idea of getting one per command card. In addition, I think you could make it so that whenever your opponent kills one of your squads in the section your hero's in then there'd be a chance that the hero died with that squad (i.e If you assign a hero to the left wing and lose a squad there, then, after the squad dies, your opponent rolls one die against the hero. If your opponent rolls a 'bonus' or a banner color of the type of the just slain squad, then the hero takes one damage. Some heroes could have multiple hp too.) I'm thinking that each player would only be allowed up to one hero in a game, and you would select that hero in a similar manner to the selection of creatures. Another spin on hero deaths is that heroes only roll for damage when a squad of the type they 'command' dies (i.e. An archer hero only rolls for damage upon the death of archer squads. If this was the case then you'd probably only get one hp on a hero.) My overall idea here is that the hero kicks in when there are 'heroic' opportunities, and that he kinda just moves around helping people in his section.
      
BL4EVER
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Tue, 25 December 2007 12:28
1. I would like to see some item "power ups" that can be used by the unit carrying the item. If the unit is killed the unit will drop the item for another unit to pick it up. Also there should be a possibility to drop the item when a unit is fleeing.

Some ideas for items.

Melee item
Enchanted sword, in melee +1d and always hit on bonusstrike

Ranged item
Crossbow of the dead, ranged combat +1 range and poison

2. Some kind of exp points for units. When a unit kills another unit award unit +1 exp token. Exp tokens may be used to level/change the banner color of, the unit.

My suggestion
1 exp token = green banner of same type (if banner is availiable)
2 exp token = blue banner of same type (if banner is availiable)
3 exp token = red banner of same type (if banner is availiable)


3. I would like to see some medics/healers on the battlefield that could heal wounded units.

4. More lore cards.

A resurrection card that can only be used when opponent has captured more banners than you would be nice (put one of your lost banners back on the field).

5. Gimme' them heroes already. Heroes with a physical presence on the field (a hero miniature not a lore master) carrying it's own hero banner (for identifying the hero and also making him an attractive target, as he awards the opponent an extra banner for killing him/her.

6. War machines. Catabults, Ballistas, Siege towers etc.

[Mis à jour le: Tue, 25 December 2007 13:00]

      
Maimed
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Tue, 25 December 2007 14:32
Caboose schrieb am Mon, 24 December 2007 18:37

Well I guess you could say C&C, but also if BL becomes too much like C&C, then why have a game that is so close to it, right ? .......

As for other people's comments/suggestions (Everyone's so far, have been great - not knocking anyone's ideas/comments, they are probably all good, but some might need to be elaborated on, so everyone can see the bigger picture of your idea. Thus if you do have something new, do try to elaborate on what you might want to do.) :

Spieler390699 :
1) " Knights on hore and on foot." - I sure hope that is a typo and you meant HORSE. Otherwise we might be getting into something that yes, it was in medieval but also DoW needs to sell the game as a family game as well, if you know what I mean. (And if you don't get what I'm talking about, then you probably are too young to understand).
2) Barbarian unit - I do like the "concept" but 6 dice seems a tad extreme, since it would have to be perhaps a red unit and then it would move very slow. Maybe you can expand on it to see where you might be trying to go on it?!?
3) C&C light troops - Not familiar with C&C so can you enlighten us here. Although I'm hoping for "new" original ideas, if there is something that would help BL, then I'm all for it. Thus more info please (for those that are not C&C enthusiasts, so everyone is on equal footing).
4) Human peasants - May I ask what is the intent for them ? I'm not seeing how they would be benefit. Not trying to knock your idea Mike, I'm just not seeing the usefulness of them.

.......
Cab



Yes HORSE, I want to keep it a nice family game HORSE

Pesents can weaken the enemy by a unit if things work out, if not they dont count as losses , I know, I know but in the Middle Ages they used them like that, hey they may even be helpful in the woods or behind a wall. I have lots of Medevel Pesents for my midevil armies and they even helped to win one about 15 years ago ! LOL Cool

The Warcounsel is really great, bu we put the warcouncel counters beind the cards ,,, it would be nice to have them on the table, maybe with an advantage for the units, but a Master in danger is certianly exciting, as well as a nice figure.

1.Other types of monsters sounds great, Centaurs with bows and spead

2. More big monsters, like anything from fantasy

3. more little animals like hawks, boar that fight for the good side, spiders , bats , etc for the Goblin side

4. A complete Goblin army! Expansion

5 a Elf Expansion!

Where am I gonna put all those fine figures,,, I talk to my wife Wink

Merry Christmas all

Cheers
Mike

      
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Tue, 25 December 2007 14:55
BL4EVER wrote on Tue, 25 December 2007 04:28


2. Some kind of exp points for units. When a unit kills another unit award unit +1 exp token. Exp tokens may be used to level/change the banner color of, the unit.

My suggestion
1 exp token = green banner of same type (if banner is availiable)
2 exp token = blue banner of same type (if banner is availiable)
3 exp token = red banner of same type (if banner is availiable)



A bit of a departure from the topic at hand, but I think this would be a very fun variant game: All the units start as green, all other rules as normal, but use some sort of experience mechanic. Something like the above, maybe 1 token to become blue, 2 more (total of 3) to become red.
      
Old Dwarf
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Tue, 25 December 2007 15:40
Ok..De Dwarf is a broken record BUT How about
giving us a Campaign World for this promised alternative Europe.

I would also 2nd the call for Elves,Undead & of course
a Tavern Tile Cool
      
Noir_Fleuri
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December 2007
Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Tue, 25 December 2007 23:07
I'd so love to see Regular or Heavy Archers.

Or maybe war machines such as catapults and ballistas.
      
Caboose
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Wed, 26 December 2007 00:04
toddrew wrote on Tue, 25 December 2007 06:55

BL4EVER wrote on Tue, 25 December 2007 04:28


2. Some kind of exp points for units. When a unit kills another unit award unit +1 exp token. Exp tokens may be used to level/change the banner color of, the unit.

My suggestion
1 exp token = green banner of same type (if banner is availiable)
2 exp token = blue banner of same type (if banner is availiable)
3 exp token = red banner of same type (if banner is availiable)



A bit of a departure from the topic at hand, but I think this would be a very fun variant game: All the units start as green, all other rules as normal, but use some sort of experience mechanic. Something like the above, maybe 1 token to become blue, 2 more (total of 3) to become red.



Todd (and I know someelse mentioned it above so I apologize for whom, but was going out the door )

I can maybe see this for perhaps a campaign type game. The surviving units get to upgrade during the scenarios and maybe as well, for a reserve / guards, one gets to draw a CtA card to add additional forces.

And thus, a green banner unit would need 5 (2 for green to blue and 3 from blue to red) to upgrade to red in 1 fell swoop.

Also what about if a unit cannot upgrade any further...what happens to those tokens - would the be used to purchase additional green units and if so, what (since some units, due to what they are, have some advantages over others)..or would they just have more units in that unit perhaps.

Will try to give it a little more thought (and hopefully look at the other items as well that I didn't reply to)...but thought I had to reply to this one since it definitely was interesting..and I saw the above as a possible way

Cab
      
toddrew
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Wed, 26 December 2007 03:22
Caboose wrote on Tue, 25 December 2007 16:04


I can maybe see this for perhaps a campaign type game.


It certainly could be a good mechanic for campaign type games, but I was thinking it would be a fun experiment in the least, and perhaps a generally fun way to play the game, for just a singular battle.

I don't know that I'll ever try it out - too much fun just playing as is Smile

[Mis à jour le: Wed, 26 December 2007 03:22]

      
Maimed
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Wed, 26 December 2007 09:04
toddrew schrieb am Wed, 26 December 2007 03:22

Caboose wrote on Tue, 25 December 2007 16:04


I can maybe see this for perhaps a campaign type game.


It certainly could be a good mechanic for campaign type games, but I was thinking it would be a fun experiment in the least, and perhaps a generally fun way to play the game, for just a singular battle.

I don't know that I'll ever try it out - too much fun just playing as is Smile



A DOW CAMPAIGN GAME YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHH!!!!
      
Maimed
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November 2007
Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Wed, 26 December 2007 09:06
See units or monster that cause so much fear that
opponets that are not bold lose 1 dice in battle!

      
Maimed
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Wed, 26 December 2007 09:07
Elite Infantry Units that can advance to the opponents hex and batte and battle


Elite Infantry Units that can advance to the opponents hex and batte and battle after driving off the enemy in a battle back


      
jscheck
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Wed, 26 December 2007 19:48
Ok, here's what I've done with the new lore master idea. Note that none of this has yet been field tested.

The Mad Alchemist

Lore Cards:

Lead Tainting
Class: Mad Alchemist
Cost: 1
Phase: Combat Phase (Play during Battle)
Target: 1 ordered unit
Effect: Target rolls +1d in battle for the entire turn.

Plate Armor
Class: Mad Alchemist
Cost: 1
Phase: Dice Roll Phase (Play before your opponent’s dice roll)
Target: 1 defending unit
Effect: Target may ignore 1 banner color hit.

Sabotage
Class: Mad Alchemist
Cost: 2
Phase: Command Phase (Play in reaction to your opponent’s Command card)
Target: Your opponent
Effect: When the your opponent rolls lore in battle, you collect lore instead of him.

Glacier
Class: Mad Alchemist
Cost: 3
Phase: Combat Phase (Play after your Combat Phase)
Target: Any vacant countryside hex
Effect: Target is impassible for your opponent’s next turn.

Rock Piling
Class: Mad Alchemist
Cost: 3
Phase: Command Phase (Play alongside your Command card)
Target: 1 river hex
Effect: Place a permanent ford on target.

Diamond Tipping
Class: Mad Alchemist
Cost: 3
Phase: Command Phase (Play alongside your command card)
Target: All ordered units
Effect: Targets roll +2d in ranged combat for the entire turn.

Nitroglycerin
Class: Mad Alchemist
Cost: 4
Phase: Dice Roll Phase (Play before your opponents dice roll)
Target: 1 defending unit
Effect: If target is killed, roll 2d against 1 enemy unit/level adjacent to target.

Crystal Barrier
Class: Mad Alchemist
Cost: 5
Phase: Command Phase (Play in reaction to your opponent’s Command card)
Target: All defending units
Effect: In Battle, targets may ignore all bonus strikes.

Water Poisoning
Class: Mad Alchemist
Cost: 5
Phase: Movement Phase (Play before your opponent’s movement phase)
Target: 1 ordered enemy unit
Effect: Target is no longer ordered. Your opponent may not order another unit.

Heavy Downpour
Class: Mad Alchemist
Cost: 6
Phase: Command Phase (Play alongside your Command card)
Target: Any countryside hex
Effect: Place a permanent marsh hex on the targeted space.

Forest Fire
Class: Mad Alchemist
Cost: 6
Phase: Command Phase (Play alongside your Command card)
Target: Any forest hex
Effect: Permanently remove targeted hex from the board.

Plantation
Class: Mad Alchemist
Cost: 6
Phase: Command Phase (Play alongside your Command card)
Target: Any countryside hex
Effect: Place a permanent forest hex on the targeted space.

Elevated Command
Class: Mad Alchemist
Cost: 8
Phase: Lore Card Symbol (Play in lieu of your command card)
Target: Your units
Effect: Order all units adjacent to or on elevated terrain.
Meteor Shower
Class: Mad Alchemist
Cost: 9
Phase: Command Phase (Play alongside your Command card)
Target: Any hex (except for rivers, lairs, and landmarks)
Effect: If a unit is on the targeted hex, roll 1d/level + 1d against unit. Unit’s banner color and lore rolled count as hits. Place a permanent crater hex on targeted space.

Hill Bowling
Class: Mad Alchemist
Cost: 10
Phase: Command Phase (Play alongside your Command card)
Target: Any hill hex
Effect: Target may move up to 1 hex/level + 2 hexes in a straight line. Roll 3d against all units on the target or in its path. Banner color and lore rolled count as hits. Flags count as retreats. If a unit vacates its hex because of a flag, it does not take damage. Target may not move through other terrain hexes. Target must stop in a countryside hex.

Specialist Card:

Fortification
For each Mad Alchemist level, you may place one wall on any countryside or elevated terrain hex anywhere on the first 5 rows of hexes on your side of the board.

Landmark:

Laboratory
Land Mines: Every turn of yours, roll 1d against all enemy units adjacent to the Laboratory. Banner color rolls count as hits. All other symbols have no effect. If captured, land mines are inactive as long as an enemy unit is on the Laboratory.

Crater:
-Does not block line of sight.
-Ranged weapons can not fire into nor out of crater.
-Unit moving in must stop for entire turn.
-Unit moving in may still battle.
-Out > in = 3d max.
-In > out = 2d max.

Any comments, ideas, corrections, thoughts...?
      
Caboose
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Wed, 26 December 2007 20:45
Js - Very nice thought for the lore cards / additional war council member.

Here are some of my thoughts / questions / comments for the "Mad" Alchemist :

1) Sabotage card
a) Since it probably will be played when a person plays a Forward (2 in each section) or Advance (Command level in 1 section) it might be a tad low in lore cost. Maybe cost of 3 or 4 lore ?!
b) What if a person plays a lore card (ie. Assault) in lieu of a command card - I suspect it cannot be played ?
c) Lastly in regards to lore cards that says the any lore rolled are considered hits (or something else to the effect that any lore rolled are not collected) what would happen with this card ? (You might want to look at timing on some of those cards since it isn't a simple question to answer since Sabotage is played during the command phase)

2) Nitroglycerin
a) Perhaps an example on this card might be nice since it state "Play before your opponents dice roll" and "1 defending unit" - seems like it would be only used in battleback and/or Warrior's First Strike.

3) Hill Bowling
a) Presume it was used on opponent's unit that you target..would they have to move backwards or not ? If backwards and there wasn't enough space and/or there was no empty countryside, what happens then ?

Crater - Very nice item - any suggestions on what to use to indicate the new terrain ?

Wall - Anything special about it ? - I think you forgot to mention the specs for it, since I suspect that it would naturally block line of sight! Smile Also are they placed anywhere or only on certain type of terrain ? Also I suspect it would be a very small wall - i.e. mounted horses would be able jump over vs a normally large wall ?!?

Laboratory Landmark - Since some landmarks do follow the normal Landmark rules and some don't, does this landmark as well (Bold to unit on it, 2 dice max in and out) ? Block line of sight or not ?

All in all, very nice write up.

Cab

[Mis à jour le: Wed, 26 December 2007 21:04]

      
Caboose
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Wed, 26 December 2007 20:51
toddrew wrote on Tue, 25 December 2007 19:22

Caboose wrote on Tue, 25 December 2007 16:04


I can maybe see this for perhaps a campaign type game.


It certainly could be a good mechanic for campaign type games, but I was thinking it would be a fun experiment in the least, and perhaps a generally fun way to play the game, for just a singular battle.

I don't know that I'll ever try it out - too much fun just playing as is Smile



And if it was done in a single battle, here are 2 thoughts

1) I suspect you would upgrade the unit upon completion of the appropriate kill.

2) Treat the upgrade like the Warrior's training camp - i.e. Let's say a green unit got a kill. On the next turn it was ordered, it would be upgraded to blue but couldn't move/battle.

In either case of upgrade, would it be healed in any way or still have the same # of pieces in the unit ?!?

Cab
      
Caboose
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Wed, 26 December 2007 21:03
BL4EVER wrote on Tue, 25 December 2007 04:28

1. I would like to see some item "power ups" that can be used by the unit carrying the item. If the unit is killed the unit will drop the item for another unit to pick it up. Also there should be a possibility to drop the item when a unit is fleeing.

Some ideas for items.

Melee item
Enchanted sword, in melee +1d and always hit on bonusstrike

Ranged item
Crossbow of the dead, ranged combat +1 range and poison



Well it doesn't have to be named "Crossbow of the Dead" but maybe Enhanced Crossbow or Bow and does a +1 range. Not sure about the poison aspect since I think one or the other would be quite powerful as is..both I think would be a tad overkill.

And of course the items would be placed somewhere in the middle of each section - maybe like 2 or 3 each - with some of them as decoys. And thus one would know if they are the item or not. And to find out if it is that item, the unit cannot battle that turn. And should it be an item the unit cannot use (i.e. +1 bow for a mounted unit) it item stays and thus still turned down.

And of course should the unit die with the enhanced item, the item would be dropped.

BL4EVER wrote on Tue, 25 December 2007 04:28


2. Some kind of exp points for units. When a unit kills another unit award unit +1 exp token. Exp tokens may be used to level/change the banner color of, the unit.

My suggestion
1 exp token = green banner of same type (if banner is availiable)
2 exp token = blue banner of same type (if banner is availiable)
3 exp token = red banner of same type (if banner is availiable)


See above on my suggestion for this.

BL4EVER wrote on Tue, 25 December 2007 04:28


3. I would like to see some medics/healers on the battlefield that could heal wounded units.

In true medieval battles, they rarely had medics/healers - and if they did, they were far away from battle. So I wouldn't be too hip on this item.

BL4EVER wrote on Tue, 25 December 2007 04:28


4. More lore cards.

A resurrection card that can only be used when opponent has captured more banners than you would be nice (put one of your lost banners back on the field).

5. Gimme' them heroes already. Heroes with a physical presence on the field (a hero miniature not a lore master) carrying it's own hero banner (for identifying the hero and also making him an attractive target, as he awards the opponent an extra banner for killing him/her.

6. War machines. Catabults, Ballistas, Siege towers etc.



I would like to see all of these as well, more so the later items if we had a castle to siege as well!

Cab
      
Caboose
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Wed, 26 December 2007 21:08
Spieler390699 wrote on Wed, 26 December 2007 01:04

toddrew schrieb am Wed, 26 December 2007 03:22

Caboose wrote on Tue, 25 December 2007 16:04


I can maybe see this for perhaps a campaign type game.


It certainly could be a good mechanic for campaign type games, but I was thinking it would be a fun experiment in the least, and perhaps a generally fun way to play the game, for just a singular battle.

I don't know that I'll ever try it out - too much fun just playing as is Smile



A DOW CAMPAIGN GAME YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHH!!!!


Not to get off topic or anything, since people have been very interested in this thread of what they would like to see for Battlelore :

If you are interested, even though it has different mechanics, there is one that Don (aka Yangtze) is trying to resurrect.

If interested, join the Yahoo group here :
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/battlelorecalltoarms/

(and in case you are interested, Todd and myself are in it)

Cab
now back to the items we'd like to see!
      
jscheck
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Wed, 26 December 2007 23:37
Caboose wrote on Wed, 26 December 2007 12:45

Js - Very nice thought for the lore cards / additional war council member.

Here are some of my thoughts / questions / comments for the "Mad" Alchemist :

1) Sabotage card
a) Since it probably will be played when a person plays a Forward (2 in each section) or Advance (Command level in 1 section) it might be a tad low in lore cost. Maybe cost of 3 or 4 lore ?!
b) What if a person plays a lore card (ie. Assault) in lieu of a command card - I suspect it cannot be played ?
c) Lastly in regards to lore cards that says the any lore rolled are considered hits (or something else to the effect that any lore rolled are not collected) what would happen with this card ? (You might want to look at timing on some of those cards since it isn't a simple question to answer since Sabotage is played during the command phase)

2) Nitroglycerin
a) Perhaps an example on this card might be nice since it state "Play before your opponents dice roll" and "1 defending unit" - seems like it would be only used in battleback and/or Warrior's First Strike.

3) Hill Bowling
a) Presume it was used on opponent's unit that you target..would they have to move backwards or not ? If backwards and there wasn't enough space and/or there was no empty countryside, what happens then ?

Crater - Very nice item - any suggestions on what to use to indicate the new terrain ?

Wall - Anything special about it ? - I think you forgot to mention the specs for it, since I suspect that it would naturally block line of sight! Smile Also are they placed anywhere or only on certain type of terrain ? Also I suspect it would be a very small wall - i.e. mounted horses would be able jump over vs a normally large wall ?!?

Laboratory Landmark - Since some landmarks do follow the normal Landmark rules and some don't, does this landmark as well (Bold to unit on it, 2 dice max in and out) ? Block line of sight or not ?

All in all, very nice write up.

Cab


1)Sabotage
a)My thoughts on this one were based on that lore seems to be very seldom rolled in combat and therefore would not often make up for the lore you paid. It is true, however, that your opponent would not gain any at all if you played it, so your probably right.
b)For what I was planning, I would say no, a "play in lieu of" lore card would not make it ineffective.
c)The idea was that you would collect lore instead of your opponent. So if rolling lore does not give him lore, you would not get any either. And, I'm sorry, I don't understand why the timing would matter in this instance.

2)Nitroglycerin
a)I'm not sure what you're saying here; I'll try to explain in greater detail. You play the card; now the target is carrying an explosive. If the target dies the turn you play it, then the explosive goes off and damages a certain number of adjacent enemy units.
For example: you have a lone banner bearer in the middle of the board somewhere. Your opponent plays a mounted charge and moves three mounted units adjacent to your unit. After your opponent declares an attack on your unit, you play "Nitroglycerin" (you have a level 2 Mad Alchemist). If your unit is killed, the nitroglycerin explodes and you may now choose 2 of the three mounted units--because you have a level 2 Alchemist--to roll 2 dice against (I forgot to mention, lores are hits and flags do nothing). Now, if you had a level 3 Alchemist, the explosion would reach all 3 of them. If your lone banner bearer survived that whole turn, then "Nitroglycerin" is now void.

3)Hill Bowling
a)If a flag is rolled against a unit and they can retreat, then they do so and take no damage. If a flag is rolled against them and they cannot retreat, then they take damage for the retreats they cannot take as well as from any banner colors or lore symbols.

As for the crater, I suppose one could always cut a hexagonal shape out of cardboard and color or draw on it.

The wall is just the ordinary, preexisting wall pieces that come with the game.

I looked over the summery cards when coming up with the landmark, so unless specified it follows the typical rules. I was not aware, however, that it was typical for landmarks to make units bold. I guess, therefore, that if that's normal for a landmark, then the Laboratory does and, if not, then it doesn't.

Thank you. Any thing else?
      
Caboose
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Thu, 27 December 2007 08:59
jscheck wrote on Wed, 26 December 2007 15:37

Caboose wrote on Wed, 26 December 2007 12:45

Js - Very nice thought for the lore cards / additional war council member.

Here are some of my thoughts / questions / comments for the "Mad" Alchemist :

1) Sabotage card
a) Since it probably will be played when a person plays a Forward (2 in each section) or Advance (Command level in 1 section) it might be a tad low in lore cost. Maybe cost of 3 or 4 lore ?!
b) What if a person plays a lore card (ie. Assault) in lieu of a command card - I suspect it cannot be played ?
c) Lastly in regards to lore cards that says the any lore rolled are considered hits (or something else to the effect that any lore rolled are not collected) what would happen with this card ? (You might want to look at timing on some of those cards since it isn't a simple question to answer since Sabotage is played during the command phase)

2) Nitroglycerin
a) Perhaps an example on this card might be nice since it state "Play before your opponents dice roll" and "1 defending unit" - seems like it would be only used in battleback and/or Warrior's First Strike.

3) Hill Bowling
a) Presume it was used on opponent's unit that you target..would they have to move backwards or not ? If backwards and there wasn't enough space and/or there was no empty countryside, what happens then ?

Crater - Very nice item - any suggestions on what to use to indicate the new terrain ?

Wall - Anything special about it ? - I think you forgot to mention the specs for it, since I suspect that it would naturally block line of sight! Smile Also are they placed anywhere or only on certain type of terrain ? Also I suspect it would be a very small wall - i.e. mounted horses would be able jump over vs a normally large wall ?!?

Laboratory Landmark - Since some landmarks do follow the normal Landmark rules and some don't, does this landmark as well (Bold to unit on it, 2 dice max in and out) ? Block line of sight or not ?

All in all, very nice write up.

Cab


1)Sabotage
a)My thoughts on this one were based on that lore seems to be very seldom rolled in combat and therefore would not often make up for the lore you paid. It is true, however, that your opponent would not gain any at all if you played it, so your probably right.
b)For what I was planning, I would say no, a "play in lieu of" lore card would not make it ineffective.
c)The idea was that you would collect lore instead of your opponent. So if rolling lore does not give him lore, you would not get any either. And, I'm sorry, I don't understand why the timing would matter in this instance.


Well I thought there was a lore card or 2 that were played in the combat phase that didn't allow for lore to be collected. But I see that I was wrong in that assumption and all of those type of lore cards are played in the command card phase like yours. So basically never mind - sorry about that! Sad

jscheck wrote on Wed, 26 December 2007 15:37


2)Nitroglycerin
a)I'm not sure what you're saying here; I'll try to explain in greater detail. You play the card; now the target is carrying an explosive. If the target dies the turn you play it, then the explosive goes off and damages a certain number of adjacent enemy units.
For example: you have a lone banner bearer in the middle of the board somewhere. Your opponent plays a mounted charge and moves three mounted units adjacent to your unit. After your opponent declares an attack on your unit, you play "Nitroglycerin" (you have a level 2 Mad Alchemist). If your unit is killed, the nitroglycerin explodes and you may now choose 2 of the three mounted units--because you have a level 2 Alchemist--to roll 2 dice against (I forgot to mention, lores are hits and flags do nothing). Now, if you had a level 3 Alchemist, the explosion would reach all 3 of them. If your lone banner bearer survived that whole turn, then "Nitroglycerin" is now void.


Well the above is definitely better explained than on initial text for the card. Only possible suggestions (with definitely saying the target gets an explosive on it + what it does) is maybe have it last till the beginning of your next turn. But then it is only a cost of 4 lore and one would probably put it on a unit that is close to death.

The only other item I can think of is that the unit that ACTUALLY cause the death of the unit would have to be the initial target of the explosion.

Lastly if it did last through the next turn, have the card only do one nitroglycerin explosion but if you had a 2nd or 3rd level alchemist, one would get to place 1 or 2 dummy charges as well. The dummy charges wouldn't do any damage but still cause a 1d die roll. On the result of a flag, the unit wouldn't be able to gain ground.

jscheck wrote on Wed, 26 December 2007 15:37


3)Hill Bowling
a)If a flag is rolled against a unit and they can retreat, then they do so and take no damage. If a flag is rolled against them and they cannot retreat, then they take damage for the retreats they cannot take as well as from any banner colors or lore symbols.


Still confused on what you are looking for in the card but not a big deal.

jscheck wrote on Wed, 26 December 2007 15:37


As for the crater, I suppose one could always cut a hexagonal shape out of cardboard and color or draw on it.

The wall is just the ordinary, preexisting wall pieces that come with the game.

I looked over the summery cards when coming up with the landmark, so unless specified it follows the typical rules. I was not aware, however, that it was typical for landmarks to make units bold. I guess, therefore, that if that's normal for a landmark, then the Laboratory does and, if not, then it doesn't.


Wall - what preexisting wall pieces - you mean the ford ?

Landmark - On page 65 of the rulebook there is some common rules/effects for Landmarks. But then if you look at the various landmarks, some of them change these generic rules. That is what I was asking about.

Cab

[Mis à jour le: Thu, 27 December 2007 09:06]

      
Caboose
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Re:What would you LIKE to see in Battlelore in the coming months Thu, 27 December 2007 10:54
toddrew wrote on Tue, 25 December 2007 06:55

BL4EVER wrote on Tue, 25 December 2007 04:28


2. Some kind of exp points for units. When a unit kills another unit award unit +1 exp token. Exp tokens may be used to level/change the banner color of, the unit.

My suggestion
1 exp token = green banner of same type (if banner is availiable)
2 exp token = blue banner of same type (if banner is availiable)
3 exp token = red banner of same type (if banner is availiable)



A bit of a departure from the topic at hand, but I think this would be a very fun variant game: All the units start as green, all other rules as normal, but use some sort of experience mechanic. Something like the above, maybe 1 token to become blue, 2 more (total of 3) to become red.



Been thinking of this a little bit more, but how about recording each hit a unit does VS giving it only when it kills a unit. That way in case a unit does most of the damage, it would get the appropriate credit. Also should a unit be damaged due to not being able to flee, the unit that did that also would get appropriate credit.

Thus modify the above to say "1 exp = 4 figures killed" and thus modify the other 2 to be 8 and 12 figures respectively.

And it also take into account when there have been some mass action spells like Forest Frenzy that might damage various units.

Cab
      
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