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Goscha
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Tired of playing for 1st Tue, 24 March 2009 06:18
Another game, called "for 1st" was finished as second without reason. That makes me tired.














[Mis à jour le: Tue, 24 March 2009 20:10]

      
AT solinsf
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Re:Tired of playing for 1st Tue, 24 March 2009 19:52
I think you might be taking BB's statement a bit too literally. BB almost always plays for first. But when someone says, "I always play for first," what he/she really means is, "I promise not to ruin a competitive game by lamely playing for 2nd." There is nothing more annoying than a player who plays for 2nd when he is 10 or 15 points out of 1st and could easily have let one of the players dump a card or two before going out.

That said, no one ALWAYS plays for first. Sometimes a game is not the least bit competitive and there is no choice, or at least no sensible choice, except to play for 2nd. Reasonable minds will differ about when this occurs. My own rules are that it's ok to play for 2nd when: (1) you're far behind (i.e. 40 or 50 pts) and another player is in the mid 90s; (2) you're far behind and another player has made it obvious he will play for 2nd if you don't; (3) 2 or more players are in the high 90s (say, 97 or up), so it's becoming nearly impossible to keep stringing the game out; or (4) one of the participants in the game believes it's a winning strategy to sit on all 16 cards every round -- a strategy which I find so stupid and annoying that I will play for 2nd, or sometimes even 3rd, just to end the game and start a new one.
      
Goscha
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Re:Tired of playing for 1st Tue, 24 March 2009 20:06
Seems like i misunderstood the playing for 1st agreement.
I thought the players play for 1st as long as its possible.
Now i often noticed, that many players choose the safety method to end as 2nd, if they are in the 90s.
Anyway.
I will delete my initial post and have to think about my own style.....
Greetings Goscha

[Mis à jour le: Tue, 24 March 2009 20:11]

      
AT solinsf
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Re:Tired of playing for 1st Tue, 24 March 2009 22:14
Goscha: I wasn't there and definitely don't want to get in the middle of this one, as I don't know what happened. I am just making general comments.

I agree that "playing for first" means playing for first as long as possible. But I think different peope interpret the word "possible" differently. If the score is 0-95-97-97, is it "possible" to get first? Technically, yes. Realistically, no. The arguments usually occur because people have different interpretations of what it means to still have a possibility at first.

Sol
      
Nayeli
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Vainqueur GoF Team Cup 2009

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April 2005
Re:Tired of playing for 1st Tue, 24 March 2009 22:50
Goscha schrieb am Tue, 24 March 2009 20:06


have to think about my own style.....
Greetings Goscha


Don't change it!

Some people name me arrogant, cause I only play with people, I know they play for first. I only want a good game, thats all. And I don't care their scores.

I would rather prefer one good game, than 100 with players which don't care their place.

Cheerio

Nay


      
Eckwald
Junior Member

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July 2006
Re:Tired of playing for 1st Wed, 25 March 2009 14:20
Stop discussions 'playing for 1st/playing for 2nd'

There are a few reasons playing for 2nd, solinsf had named the most of them.
If i have no chance to become 1st, why i shouldn't try to get 2nd? The most important-i think-is, to play fair and not against another player...

There is no discussion, that everybody try to get 1st, me too Very Happy

Greetings
Eckwald

P.S. Sorry to my poor english... Rolling Eyes
      
express--
Member

Messages: 47
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October 2006
Re:Tired of playing for 1st Thu, 26 March 2009 00:12
Well I was the other one in the game with Goscha. I can honestly say I was shocked when BB did what he did. More than shocked. If I remember correctly I had 79 points, Goscha had 82 points, BB had 94 points and hdoc had 24 points. We had kept BB in the game for already a few rounds as we were working hdoc up in the points. There was no reason to suspect that one of us couldn't get a great hand next time and give hdoc even more points. I've seen it happen many times, even for me when I was in the 90's for points. I never give up until the very end to play for first. In this case the game would not have ended; BB would not have been over 100 so we would have had another round.

But then BB stated just before he played out something to the effect of "I'll get what I can" and immediately played for 2nd (something both Goscha and I COULD have done many times in the last few hands but didn't). I can see playing for 2nd when there are a 2 or 3 players over 90 points, but even then I hesitate on it because I have seen comebacks. This, in my opinion, was NOT the time or place to yet play for 2nd and even now I'm not sure of BB's motives.

I believe one player I know calls it "integrity".

Regards,
TT express
      
SKMorefield
Senior Member

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January 2005
Re:Tired of playing for 1st Sun, 24 May 2009 21:24
solinsf wrote on Tue, 24 March 2009 14:52

I think you might be taking BB's statement a bit too literally. BB almost always plays for first. But when someone says, "I always play for first," what he/she really means is, "I promise not to ruin a competitive game by lamely playing for 2nd." There is nothing more annoying than a player who plays for 2nd when he is 10 or 15 points out of 1st and could easily have let one of the players dump a card or two before going out.

That said, no one ALWAYS plays for first. Sometimes a game is not the least bit competitive and there is no choice, or at least no sensible choice, except to play for 2nd. Reasonable minds will differ about when this occurs. My own rules are that it's ok to play for 2nd when: (1) you're far behind (i.e. 40 or 50 pts) and another player is in the mid 90s; (2) you're far behind and another player has made it obvious he will play for 2nd if you don't; (3) 2 or more players are in the high 90s (say, 97 or up), so it's becoming nearly impossible to keep stringing the game out; or (4) one of the participants in the game believes it's a winning strategy to sit on all 16 cards every round -- a strategy which I find so stupid and annoying that I will play for 2nd, or sometimes even 3rd, just to end the game and start a new one.



I just had a couple of experiences today and looked this thread up to see if others had something to say. I completely agree with the above post. I understand that it would be wrong to, say, purposefully lead in a pair when the winning player has 2 left and everyone else has a ton, in a purposeful attempt to end the game and not finish last. However, as it happened to me today, I had excellent hands and decided to play them to the maximum in order to try and maximize my finish in games that were arguably OVER, or would have been over in a hand or two. Who knows when I might get another good hand? I think it is petty and silly to criticize someone just for playing their cards and winning the hand. I was able to scrape for 3rd in the first game, and ended up 2nd in the other, a game where someone was at 83 and the winner was in the teens. I was lucky to have those finishes. But usually, yes, I do play for first.

Why all the fuss anyway? It is certainly better to be 2nd than to be last, no? Maybe I just haven't played GOF enough...


Best Regards,
SKM
      
    
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