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player778339
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July 2011
Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Sun, 17 July 2011 04:43
Cyan4973 wrote on Sat, 16 July 2011 20:59

Quote:

An in decline race is in control of the Pentacle can move the Balrog and then decline the active race leaving the Pentacle space empty.


That's not possible. As mentionend in the rule book :

Quote:

 Popular Places' powers cannot be used by Races that are In Decline;


So, your race in decline cannot move the Balrog. This has nothing to do with your currently active race going into decline : this is always true, a declined race cannot move the Balrog, period.




I missed that part in the rule book but it of course makes sense.

Thanks for pointing out that mistake.
      
TheQfi
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Sun, 17 July 2011 07:18
BStout wrote on Sun, 17 July 2011 03:32

player778339 wrote on Sat, 16 July 2011 16:41

When exactly is "the start of each of your turns?" That is listed in the Reborn Power explanation. Would that be before you pick to either "Expand the reach of his race" or "Put his race In Decline to select a new one?"

I assume that moving the Balrog "once at any point during his turn" can include the start of each of your turns.
...
So essentially do you get to use applicable relics/powers before you pick to expand/decline or must you always pick first and see what is left to use after that choice?

Interesting questions!

I'm pretty sure that the answer is No, you cannot use Relics and/or Places during turns you go into decline.


This is an interesting and far-fetching question. I think that the crew could give a big answer on all the things that you can do on the turn that you decide to go into decline. I already know that you can use your in-decline Spirit Ghouls or rearrange your Tomb tokens. And of course, you can use all the places and relics of Underworld that are specified to work once in decline. So please, crew, can you make a list of all of the actions that you could possibly take on a turn that sends your active race into decline!

[Mis à jour le: Sun, 17 July 2011 07:19]

      
Deio
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January 2011
Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Sun, 17 July 2011 10:41
Robin écrit le Sat, 16 July 2011 17:14

Deio écrit le Sat, 16 July 2011 15:43

I was just giving an opinion; sorry, I won't do it again, I promise...
Why be sorry?
I don't see anything offending in your posts. Just confronting logics and trying by mutual argumentation to understand what the rules are really about.
Sorry from my part if my argumentation was too blunt - I assure you that there was no attempt to go personal nor any emotion in my post. Rolling Eyes

I was being ironic ^^ ... And yes, your answer seemed a bit blunt to me, but I guess I was wrong on that one.

So let's get back to our topic: I had a thought about Krakens, and it appeared to me that it would be quite logical for them to be allowed to leave River regions when redeploying...

And about the questions on what you are allowed to do the turn you get into decline... I always figured that no action was allowed on that turn...
      
Cyan4973
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June 2011
Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Sun, 17 July 2011 12:27
Deio écrit le Sun, 17 July 2011 10:41

And about the questions on what you are allowed to do the turn you get into decline... I always figured that no action was allowed on that turn...


I also believed the same, but then i checked the rulebook, and the wording is much less restrictive :

RuleBook

The player can make no conquests during the turn his race goes into decline;


And that's it.
      
Cyan4973
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Sun, 17 July 2011 12:54
TheQfi écrit le Sun, 17 July 2011 07:18

I think that the crew could give a big answer on all the things that you can do on the turn that you decide to go into decline. I already know that you can use your in-decline Spirit Ghouls


Well, that's not correct, at least not according to the FAQ posted in this forum :

forum's FAQ

Q: With non-spirit Ghouls in decline and Elves as the active race. What sequence for the turn is used if Elves are put into decline?
A: 1. Send Elves into decline (Removing all Ghouls from the board)
2. Score VPs for Elves
There is no attack phase for the in-decline Ghouls because there is only an attack phase in a turn if that turn is spent expanding, not going into decline with a race (your Elves, here).


So, to sum up, since there is no conquest on the turn one goes into decline, there is also no opportunity to use Ghouls one last time before vanishing.
      
TheQfi
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Sun, 17 July 2011 14:51
Cyan4973 wrote on Sun, 17 July 2011 13:54

TheQfi écrit le Sun, 17 July 2011 07:18

I think that the crew could give a big answer on all the things that you can do on the turn that you decide to go into decline. I already know that you can use your in-decline Spirit Ghouls


Well, that's not correct, at least not according to the FAQ posted in this forum :

forum's FAQ

Q: With non-spirit Ghouls in decline and Elves as the active race. What sequence for the turn is used if Elves are put into decline?
A: 1. Send Elves into decline (Removing all Ghouls from the board)
2. Score VPs for Elves
There is no attack phase for the in-decline Ghouls because there is only an attack phase in a turn if that turn is spent expanding, not going into decline with a race (your Elves, here).


So, to sum up, since there is no conquest on the turn one goes into decline, there is also no opportunity to use Ghouls one last time before vanishing.


No, this doesn't answer my question. If your read carefully, the Ghouls in question are NON-SPIRIT, which the FAQ adresses. The FAQ doesn't answer the question on behalf of Spirit Ghouls in decline, which I addressed. Spirit Ghouls in decline are never removed from the map, unless they are completely wiped out. This answer doesn't apply in the special case of in-decline Spirit Ghouls.
      
BStout
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Sun, 17 July 2011 19:55
TheQfi wrote on Sun, 17 July 2011 01:18

This is an interesting and far-fetching question. I think that the crew could give a big answer on all the things that you can do on the turn that you decide to go into decline. I already know that you can use your in-decline Spirit Ghouls or rearrange your Tomb tokens. And of course, you can use all the places and relics of Underworld that are specified to work once in decline. So please, crew, can you make a list of all of the actions that you could possibly take on a turn that sends your active race into decline!

Can you give a reference? I have never seen a ruling that any race can attack in turns when you decline.

Yes, Tomb combos can redeploy on the turn they go into decline -- it is explicitly stated in the Tomb rules.

My earlier statement was too broad. I should have said "you cannot use Relics and/or Places to move or attack during turns you go into decline." You can of course use their scoring and immunity benefits, as specified individually.
      
Cyan4973
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June 2011
Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Sun, 17 July 2011 23:29
TheQfi écrit le Sun, 17 July 2011 14:51

The FAQ doesn't answer the question on behalf of Spirit Ghouls in decline, which I addressed. Spirit Ghouls in decline are never removed from the map, unless they are completely wiped out.


My bad, i missed the "spirit" attribute mentioned.

However, i believe the FAQ answer still do apply.
The rule is simple : no conquest during the turn your active race go into decline (except if the active race has the "Stout" attribute). This is explicitly written in the rule book (the sentence is the same as for SWU) :

SW RuleBook

The player can make no conquests during the turn his race goes into decline;


Therefore, no conquest phase. It also applies to your Ghouls.
I agree they remain on the map, since their attribute "Spirit" give them this right. So they will be able to attack again on next turn.

As usual, if DoW states otherwise, their advise will become the new rule.
      
TheQfi
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Mon, 18 July 2011 06:16
BStout wrote on Sun, 17 July 2011 20:55

TheQfi wrote on Sun, 17 July 2011 01:18

This is an interesting and far-fetching question. I think that the crew could give a big answer on all the things that you can do on the turn that you decide to go into decline. I already know that you can use your in-decline Spirit Ghouls or rearrange your Tomb tokens. And of course, you can use all the places and relics of Underworld that are specified to work once in decline. So please, crew, can you make a list of all of the actions that you could possibly take on a turn that sends your active race into decline!

Can you give a reference? I have never seen a ruling that any race can attack in turns when you decline.

Yes, Tomb combos can redeploy on the turn they go into decline -- it is explicitly stated in the Tomb rules.

My earlier statement was too broad. I should have said "you cannot use Relics and/or Places to move or attack during turns you go into decline." You can of course use their scoring and immunity benefits, as specified individually.



No, I cannot give you reference. This is a decision our group has made, which is loosely based on the FAQ. There are two reasons, why we have made this decision. 1) The FAQ has a very funny formatting, when addressing the question (which Cyan pasted). Why do they specifically mention NON-SPIRIT Ghouls in decline instead of just Ghouls in decline? 2) A spirit race in decline is a special case, and it doesn't really count as a normal in-decline race. We gave permission for the in-decline Spirit Ghouls to attack every turn, because they behave like an active race, and are never discarded, when an active race goes into decline. We decided to ignore the rule that "The player can make no conquests during the turn his race goes into decline" for these reasons.

It would be nice to know how the crew feels about this...
      
BStout
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Mon, 18 July 2011 06:50
TheQfi wrote on Mon, 18 July 2011 00:16

The FAQ has a very funny formatting, when addressing the question (which Cyan pasted). Why do they specifically mention NON-SPIRIT Ghouls in decline instead of just Ghouls in decline?

Probably because that's how the person who submitted the question worded it, and that was the situation he had come across.

I don't mind that you have a house rule, as long as you don't confuse it with an official rule. For most people, the explicit rule that "The player can make no conquests during the turn his race goes into decline" would trump a speculative indirect implication. So instead of saying you "knew" that in-decline Spirit Ghouls could conquer in a turn that its owner put his active race in decline, you should have said you "suspected" or "guessed" or "believed" it.
      
TheQfi
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Mon, 18 July 2011 08:25
BStout wrote on Mon, 18 July 2011 07:50

TheQfi wrote on Mon, 18 July 2011 00:16

The FAQ has a very funny formatting, when addressing the question (which Cyan pasted). Why do they specifically mention NON-SPIRIT Ghouls in decline instead of just Ghouls in decline?

Probably because that's how the person who submitted the question worded it, and that was the situation he had come across.

I don't mind that you have a house rule, as long as you don't confuse it with an official rule. For most people, the explicit rule that "The player can make no conquests during the turn his race goes into decline" would trump a speculative indirect implication. So instead of saying you "knew" that in-decline Spirit Ghouls could conquer in a turn that its owner put his active race in decline, you should have said you "suspected" or "guessed" or "believed" it.


Bstout, of course, you are correct. I should have made it clear that there is nothing to support that in-decline Spirit Ghouls can attack during every turn. This is just logic that has come across our group. Same applies to Were Amazons, for example. We have allowed Were Amazons (just to give an example) to abandon regions after their conquests, if that was the only way they could muster the 4 tokens, that need to be taken off the board. This has been mere logic in order to go in between two contradicting rules, which is quite often the case in Smallworld, and very often in Underworld.
      
AernoutMJC
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Mon, 18 July 2011 09:27
Out of curiosity, how should one go about fighting Immortal Iron Dwarves in a 1v1 battle? I got to start and thus got three hammers on my first turn. Opponent was both speech- and powerless. In the end I went in decline having demolished 2 races of his completely and because I thought my advantage was unfair.
      
BStout
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Mon, 18 July 2011 15:28
TheQfi wrote on Mon, 18 July 2011 02:25

We have allowed Were Amazons (just to give an example) to abandon regions after their conquests, if that was the only way they could muster the 4 tokens, that need to be taken off the board.

Yes, that's how Amazons are supposed to work, with any special power! That's why their description says "remove four tokens from the map, making sure to leave at least one Amazon token in each of your Regions if possible".

Also, the SW FAQ says:
Quote:

Troop Redeployment
You must leave at least one race token in each region conquered at the end of your turn, except for the amazons. In this case you must take off four race tokens, abandoning regions you've just conquered if required.
      
BStout
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Mon, 18 July 2011 15:36
player759311 wrote on Mon, 18 July 2011 03:27

Out of curiosity, how should one go about fighting Immortal Iron Dwarves in a 1v1 battle? I got to start and thus got three hammers on my first turn. Opponent was both speech- and powerless. In the end I went in decline having demolished 2 races of his completely and because I thought my advantage was unfair.

First, I would make sure that Iron Dwarves use at least one ID token in each conquest -- no conquests with just Hammers. (On p. 2 of this thread I argue why I think the SWU FAQ is mistaken about this.)

Second, I would consider eliminating his in-decline race to deprive him of its income. Of course in your case there was no declined race.

Third, I would look for a combo whose advantages could counteract against the Immortal IDs, and/or Relics or Places that could help.

Fourth, I might consider outlawing Immortal Iron Dwarves for 2-player games.
      
tyberius
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Mon, 18 July 2011 17:00
Balrog Movement question:
Rules:
1st turn, Balrog must be placed adjacent to Pentacle
Subsequent turns, Balrog moved to an adjacent space.

For subsequent turns, does this mean Balrog moves still adjacent to pentacle, or adjacent to where he currently stands? (Does the Balrog hang out near the Pentacle all game, or can he run amok across the whole board, moving one space per turn?)
We've been playing he hangs at the pentacle.
      
Deio
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Mon, 18 July 2011 18:04
BStout écrit le Mon, 18 July 2011 15:36

player759311 wrote on Mon, 18 July 2011 03:27

Out of curiosity, how should one go about fighting Immortal Iron Dwarves in a 1v1 battle? I got to start and thus got three hammers on my first turn. Opponent was both speech- and powerless. In the end I went in decline having demolished 2 races of his completely and because I thought my advantage was unfair.

First, I would make sure that Iron Dwarves use at least one ID token in each conquest -- no conquests with just Hammers. (On p. 2 of this thread I argue why I think the SWU FAQ is mistaken about this.)

I am very sorry, but I think you are wrong about the way Hammers must be used. I read your argument, which I think is very good by the way, but apparently there is a slight "mistake" in the rules booklet.

You state that the absence of the words "if possible" in the description of the Iron Dwarves makes the whole difference, and I could perfectly have agreed with that. But in fact, if you take a look at the french version of the rules, you will see that these very words are present in the description. So I think they were just forgotten in the english version; and SWU FAQ is therefore right... And yes, Iron Dwarves can be very strong...

So how to fight them in a 1v1 game? Tough question... Hide in a hole? Conquer all Mines first? Choose the Gnomes? It depends a lot on the possibilities you have...

About the Balrog: this "nice" creature can move one space each turn, and is not supposed to hang near the Pentacle all game... So yes, it is better if you are the one controlling it! Razz
      
elros
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Mon, 18 July 2011 19:06
Using the Reborn power:

Is it possible to use the reborn power the turn after the reborn race goes into decline, i.e. when picking a new race, can the player then substitute that active race for 1 or 2 of his ID reborn on the board, or must he wait another full turn to use this ability? (two turns after the reborn race declined)
      
Evil Spock
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Mon, 18 July 2011 19:39
Here is something that we encountered during our first time playing SWU:

How do Cultists interact with the Great Brass Horn? In our case, the player in question first conquered the territory with the Great Brass Horn on it, which in this case happened to be a mud territory. Therefore, all mud regions are considered adjacent. Since it was the first territory conquered, the Great Ancient was placed in that same space. Since his power allows all adjacent spaces to be conquered with one less token than normal, does that mean that EVERY mud space on the board could be reached and conquered with one less token than normal? That seems to be a legitimate reading of the rules, but I just wanted to verify since it can be quite effective.
      
BStout
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Mon, 18 July 2011 20:09
Deio wrote on Mon, 18 July 2011 12:04

You state that the absence of the words "if possible" in the description of the Iron Dwarves makes the whole difference, and I could perfectly have agreed with that. But in fact, if you take a look at the french version of the rules, you will see that these very words are present in the description. So I think they were just forgotten in the english version; and SWU FAQ is therefore right... And yes, Iron Dwarves can be very strong...

Oh no! Shocked

IMO, it makes the Iron Dwarves too strong. I'll probably house-rule it as if the English translation were correct.
      
Deio
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Mon, 18 July 2011 20:25
elros écrit le Mon, 18 July 2011 19:06

Using the Reborn power:

Is it possible to use the reborn power the turn after the reborn race goes into decline, i.e. when picking a new race, can the player then substitute that active race for 1 or 2 of his ID reborn on the board, or must he wait another full turn to use this ability? (two turns after the reborn race declined)


You can use your Reborn power the turn you pick a new race.

Evil Spock écrit le Mon, 18 July 2011 19:39

Here is something that we encountered during our first time playing SWU:

How do Cultists interact with the Great Brass Horn? In our case, the player in question first conquered the territory with the Great Brass Horn on it, which in this case happened to be a mud territory. Therefore, all mud regions are considered adjacent. Since it was the first territory conquered, the Great Ancient was placed in that same space. Since his power allows all adjacent spaces to be conquered with one less token than normal, does that mean that EVERY mud space on the board could be reached and conquered with one less token than normal? That seems to be a legitimate reading of the rules, but I just wanted to verify since it can be quite effective.

Yes, in the case you describe, Cultists would be able to conquer every Mud region with one less token than normal.
      
allstar64
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Tue, 19 July 2011 22:55
Antoine wrote on Thu, 16 June 2011 11:19


In Small World
Q. How to play Flames in SW?
A. Flames must be used with a volcano. They may take ANY mountain region as their first conquest (spending the necessary number of tokens) then place the volcano on it and apply normal Flames rules. The volcano region is immune as long as the Flames are active.



I take it the Flames used to conquer the first mountain cannot be used again during that turn to conquer more but is the mountain region (with the volcano) considered a region for scoring for the Flames? If so must they leave a unit there like with Hobbit Holes?


Quote:



Q. How to play Spiderines in SW?
A. Play Spiderines as an "Underworld" Race: conquer any Cavern Region at 1 less token
than usual. All Regions with a Cavern are considered adjacent. "Underworld Spiderines" would be useless and their Special Power may be replaced with some other Power in this case.



This is not entirely true. While its true the "All Regions with a Cavern are considered adjacent" part of underworld is rendered useless the "conquer any Cavern Region at 1 less token" would actually be very useful and would end up allowing Spiderines to conquer cavern squares at a -2 discount. Since a bunch of cavern squares have mountains on them and are often occupied I don't see this as a power that needs reshuffling.

Flying-Halflings (or even Flying Spiderines for that matter), for example have their racial power to enter the board from anywhere (or cavern spaces linked) encompassed by flying but they still have their other power and gain benefit from flying different from their racial ability.

However, while on the subject of flying

Quote:


Q. How to play Lizardmen in SW?
A. Lizardmen run over water, which means that they treat lake and sea like river regions, thus may freely cross them.



Flying Lizardmen would also be a redundant combo however unlike most of the redundant combos listed it is not the attribute that is redundant but the race. Flying completely encompasses the power of the lizardmen. As such I think it would be fair to allow for repicking of the race banner (or attribute) if this combo come up.
      
AernoutMJC
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Wed, 20 July 2011 22:51
allstar64 wrote on Tue, 19 July 2011 22:55

Antoine wrote on Thu, 16 June 2011 11:19


In Small World
Q. How to play Flames in SW?
A. Flames must be used with a volcano. They may take ANY mountain region as their first conquest (spending the necessary number of tokens) then place the volcano on it and apply normal Flames rules. The volcano region is immune as long as the Flames are active.



I take it the Flames used to conquer the first mountain cannot be used again during that turn to conquer more but is the mountain region (with the volcano) considered a region for scoring for the Flames? If so must they leave a unit there like with Hobbit Holes?


Quote:



Q. How to play Spiderines in SW?
A. Play Spiderines as an "Underworld" Race: conquer any Cavern Region at 1 less token
than usual. All Regions with a Cavern are considered adjacent. "Underworld Spiderines" would be useless and their Special Power may be replaced with some other Power in this case.



This is not entirely true. While its true the "All Regions with a Cavern are considered adjacent" part of underworld is rendered useless the "conquer any Cavern Region at 1 less token" would actually be very useful and would end up allowing Spiderines to conquer cavern squares at a -2 discount. Since a bunch of cavern squares have mountains on them and are often occupied I don't see this as a power that needs reshuffling.

Flying-Halflings (or even Flying Spiderines for that matter), for example have their racial power to enter the board from anywhere (or cavern spaces linked) encompassed by flying but they still have their other power and gain benefit from flying different from their racial ability.

However, while on the subject of flying

Quote:


Q. How to play Lizardmen in SW?
A. Lizardmen run over water, which means that they treat lake and sea like river regions, thus may freely cross them.



Flying Lizardmen would also be a redundant combo however unlike most of the redundant combos listed it is not the attribute that is redundant but the race. Flying completely encompasses the power of the lizardmen. As such I think it would be fair to allow for repicking of the race banner (or attribute) if this combo come up.


The volcano is a chasm, not a mountain region.
      
BStout
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Wed, 20 July 2011 23:21
player759311 wrote on Wed, 20 July 2011 16:51

allstar64 wrote on Tue, 19 July 2011 22:55

Antoine wrote on Thu, 16 June 2011 11:19


In Small World
Q. How to play Flames in SW?
A. Flames must be used with a volcano. They may take ANY mountain region as their first conquest (spending the necessary number of tokens) then place the volcano on it and apply normal Flames rules. The volcano region is immune as long as the Flames are active.

I take it the Flames used to conquer the first mountain cannot be used again during that turn to conquer more but is the mountain region (with the volcano) considered a region for scoring for the Flames? If so must they leave a unit there like with Hobbit Holes?

The volcano is a chasm, not a mountain region.


He's referring to the use of the SWU races on the surface SW board.

Referring to allstar64's questions:

- I am certain that the Flames tokens used to conquer the first Mountain region cannot be used again that same turn.

- Since the Flames must conquer the Mountain region, I reckon that they score for it.

- I don't know if the Flames must keep a token in that region. I could see it going either way. The rules say that region is immune to conquest as long as the Flames are active, so no one else could conquer it; but I guess the Flames could abandon it and still keep their benefit as long as they have a chain leading up to it.

Antoine?
      
Deio
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Thu, 21 July 2011 09:08
Antoine answered that question on another french forum. Here is what he wrote:

Antoine wrote in a french forum (trictrac.net):

Enfin, pour l'adaptation des Flammes dans SW, après discussion avec Philippe Keyaerts, à qui j'ai fait remonter la question, je reformule : les Flammes doivent se redéployer en dehors du volcan, et la région ne rapporte pas de points : elles est infranchissable pour quiconque tant que les Flammes sont actives, après quoi le Volcan disparaît. L'idée est de se rapprocher le plus possible de SWU.

And here is a translation:
Deio translated:

Finally, about using Flames in SW, after discussing with Philippe Keyaerts, to whom I forwarded the question, the rules are: Flames must redeploy out of the Volcano, and they don't earn any point for that region: the region becomes impassable for anyone as long as Flames are active. When they get in decline, the Volcano disappears. The idea is to be closest as possible to SWU rules.

I think that we now have all we need to play Flames, wherever we want to play them Very Happy .
      
TheQfi
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Thu, 21 July 2011 10:02
Deio wrote on Thu, 21 July 2011 10:08

Antoine answered that question on another french forum. Here is what he wrote:

Antoine wrote in a french forum (trictrac.net):

Enfin, pour l'adaptation des Flammes dans SW, après discussion avec Philippe Keyaerts, à qui j'ai fait remonter la question, je reformule : les Flammes doivent se redéployer en dehors du volcan, et la région ne rapporte pas de points : elles est infranchissable pour quiconque tant que les Flammes sont actives, après quoi le Volcan disparaît. L'idée est de se rapprocher le plus possible de SWU.

And here is a translation:
Deio translated:

Finally, about using Flames in SW, after discussing with Philippe Keyaerts, to whom I forwarded the question, the rules are: Flames must redeploy out of the Volcano, and they don't earn any point for that region: the region becomes impassable for anyone as long as Flames are active. When they get in decline, the Volcano disappears. The idea is to be closest as possible to SWU rules.

I think that we now have all we need to play Flames, wherever we want to play them Very Happy .


Does this mean that the Volcano is not impassable to even the Spiderlines? Meaning that Spiderlines cannot crawl up from the volcano, like they can crawl up from other chasms?
      
Deio
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Thu, 21 July 2011 10:50
TheQfi écrit le Thu, 21 July 2011 10:02

Does this mean that the Volcano is not impassable to even the Spiderlines? Meaning that Spiderlines cannot crawl up from the volcano, like they can crawl up from other chasms?

If you are playing on SWU board, Spiderines can crawl up from the Volcano, exactly like they can from other Chasms.

In my message above, I was only referring to the case in which you are playing on SW board (i.e. the surface). In that case, the Volcano is impassable to every Race, Spiderines included. As a reminder : when playing on the surface, Spiderines power becomes similar to the Underworld power, meaning they can use Caverns, and not Chasms.
      
etowey
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August 2011
Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Fri, 05 August 2011 15:52
Say Stonehenge is discovered to contain the Royal power, and the Queen is deployed at Stonehenge. If the controlling race Vanishes, can Stonehenge be conquered again, or is it immune to attack and effectively removed from play?
      
TheQfi
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July 2010
Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Fri, 05 August 2011 16:10
player789517 wrote on Fri, 05 August 2011 16:52

Say Stonehenge is discovered to contain the Royal power, and the Queen is deployed at Stonehenge. If the controlling race Vanishes, can Stonehenge be conquered again, or is it immune to attack and effectively removed from play?



This is a difficult question now that I think of it. It can go 2 ways as I see it.

1) Once the controlling race is active, the Queen will make the Stonehenge immune. Once the controlling race enters decline (the player chooses a new active race), the Queen will still stay on the Stonehenge keeping it immune, but can no longer be moved. This means that your new active race cannot conquer the Stone Henge. When the player yet again chooses a new active race, the Queen is removed from the Stonehenge along with all of the tokens that originally conquered it. So, yes: The Queen will make the Stone Henge immune. But if the player keep on choosing new active races, the Queen will eventually be removed from the map.

2) Once the active race controlling the Stonehenge goes into decline, the Stonehenge's power is lost. The Queen is immediately removed from from the map, and it can re-enter the map once a new active race conquers the Stonehenge.

This is actually a very profound question, and it needs to be answered in the FAQ. Royal has an effect to races that are active and races that are in decline. Usually the effect of the Stonehenge is applied to either an active race or a passive race. But can it have an effect to BOTH? Royal most definitely affects an active race controlling it, but does this mean that Royal cannot have an effect on a passive race anymore?

[Mis à jour le: Fri, 05 August 2011 17:16]

      
player791677
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August 2011
Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Mon, 08 August 2011 21:41
Some questions:

Do Will-o'-wisps get a final conquest attempt after they used their ability but were not able to conquer the region?

Am I correct to say that Mushroom armor can never be redeployed during troop redeployment?

If you go into decline with a vanishing race, do you get the points from being in the Mine of the lost dwarf or the keep on the motherland. I would guess not, because normally you first go into decline and only score points afterwards.

      
Two-Edge
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Leytenant

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July 2011
Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Mon, 08 August 2011 21:53
player791677 wrote on Mon, 08 August 2011 23:41

Some questions:

Do Will-o'-wisps get a final conquest attempt after they used their ability but were not able to conquer the region?

Am I correct to say that Mushroom armor can never be redeployed during troop redeployment?

If you go into decline with a vanishing race, do you get the points from being in the Mine of the lost dwarf or the keep on the motherland. I would guess not, because normally you first go into decline and only score points afterwards.





1. Yes.

2. Correct.

3. You're right
      
Jrandom37
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May 2011
Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Wed, 17 August 2011 05:52
Can Gnomes attack a area protected by the Spirit of the Tomb Raider? And if so, when the Tomb is held by an In-Decline race, are the Gnomes provided Immunity since they occupy the a space with the Ghost?

When Mummies want to move across water, do they need to use 2 tokens to do it?
      
Deio
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January 2011
Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Wed, 17 August 2011 10:21
Jrandom37 écrit le Wed, 17 August 2011 05:52

Can Gnomes attack a area protected by the Spirit of the Tomb Raider? And if so, when the Tomb is held by an In-Decline race, are the Gnomes provided Immunity since they occupy the a space with the Ghost?

When Mummies want to move across water, do they need to use 2 tokens to do it?

1. Absolutely not! The Spirit makes a region immune to every attack or power. Furthermore, you have to remember that Gnomes power is only active when they are attacked, not when they are attacking!

2. Yes, Mummies do need 2 tokens to conquer a River region.
      
Larsine
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November 2005
Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Tue, 23 August 2011 23:02
Antoine wrote on Thu, 16 June 2011 17:19


Redundant or contradictory combos
If useless combos appear, you may replace their Special Power with another one, drawn at random from the Special Powers stack.
Known useless combos: Frightened Pixies, Immortal Elves, Seafaring Krakens, Tomb Ghouls, Tomb White Ladies, Underworld Spiderines, Vampire Kobolds, Vanishing Ghouls, Vanishing Priestesses, Vanishing White Ladies.


So does this also apply to Vanishing Liches?

Vanishing Liches are just as useless as many of the mentioned combinations.

EDIT: Spelling!

[Mis à jour le: Wed, 24 August 2011 08:17]

      
Deio
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January 2011
Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Wed, 24 August 2011 11:06
That's right, Vanishing Liches should logically be considered as a useless combination too.
      
Larsine
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November 2005
Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Wed, 24 August 2011 17:42
Personally I think there is no such thing as a useless combination. Some combinations are just better than others, and the worse combinations will accumulate coins, and make the attractive.

Otherwise we should outlaw Cursed Dwarfs, since they are the most useless combination I can ever think of.
      
Deio
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January 2011
Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Thu, 25 August 2011 14:40
Well, you can play the game the way you wish. Replacing "useless" combinations is just a suggestion made by DoW team, but nothing forces you to do so if you don't want to (hence the words "you may replace" used in the FAQ).

Keeping these combinations in play and waiting for them to accumulate coins is also a perfectly viable option.
      
davidwc09
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Tenente

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August 2010
Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Sat, 27 August 2011 01:42
BStout wrote on Mon, 18 July 2011 13:09

Deio wrote on Mon, 18 July 2011 12:04

You state that the absence of the words "if possible" in the description of the Iron Dwarves makes the whole difference, and I could perfectly have agreed with that. But in fact, if you take a look at the french version of the rules, you will see that these very words are present in the description. So I think they were just forgotten in the english version; and SWU FAQ is therefore right... And yes, Iron Dwarves can be very strong...

Oh no! Shocked

IMO, it makes the Iron Dwarves too strong. I'll probably house-rule it as if the English translation were correct.

We have house-ruled Iron Dwarves so that they generate their Silver Hammers anew each time. Otherwise, they quickly balloon to seven and can dominate. I've seen them rule for entire games, and just saying, "Go attack them," as some have stated, is far too simplistic and naive an answer.
      
*player38092
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Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Sat, 27 August 2011 08:53
davidwc09 écrit le Sat, 27 August 2011 01:42

just saying, "Go attack them," as some have stated, is far too simplistic and naive an answer.
Perhaps, but creating a house "grudge" rule is far too easy an answer to the problem.
Rather than immediately accuse the game system, try appropriate tactics to overcome the problems that you are confronted with, rather than change the rules to accomodate your inability to solve the problems.
      
JoeLastname
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October 2011
Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Sun, 02 October 2011 20:42
Does the Shiny Orb cause immortal tokens it is used on to be discarded in the same manner as the Vampire power?

(My intuition says yes, however there's room to argue that it does not, since the Vampire power explicitly mentions discarding immortal tokens and the shiny orb says only to refer to the Vampire power for how a "single" token is defined, not that it behaves exactly as a one-use Vampire power. No mention of discarding Immortal tokens appears in the Shiny Orb's rules)
      
JoeLastname
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October 2011
Re:Official Small World Underground FAQ Sun, 02 October 2011 21:44
davidwc09 wrote on Fri, 26 August 2011 19:42

BStout wrote on Mon, 18 July 2011 13:09

Deio wrote on Mon, 18 July 2011 12:04

You state that the absence of the words "if possible" in the description of the Iron Dwarves makes the whole difference, and I could perfectly have agreed with that. But in fact, if you take a look at the french version of the rules, you will see that these very words are present in the description. So I think they were just forgotten in the english version; and SWU FAQ is therefore right... And yes, Iron Dwarves can be very strong...

Oh no! Shocked

IMO, it makes the Iron Dwarves too strong. I'll probably house-rule it as if the English translation were correct.

We have house-ruled Iron Dwarves so that they generate their Silver Hammers anew each time. Otherwise, they quickly balloon to seven and can dominate. I've seen them rule for entire games, and just saying, "Go attack them," as some have stated, is far too simplistic and naive an answer.


Played my first SWU game last night. Four players, all well familiar with Small World. We used only the Small World Underground components. Maybe it's unfamiliarity with how Underground differs from Small World, but the (dreaded?) Immortal Iron Dwarves appeared on turn 3 of our game, had all hammers by turn 6. The player in question kept them until the end, proceeded to be unable to score more than 10 points on any turn, and came in third place. Mind you, both Gnomes and a Vampire race were on the table, so it may be seen that it wasn't the most favourable conditions under which to be Immortal, or an Iron Dwarf. However, my take on it is still, you get one turn where you essentially have no race power, one turn where you're roughly as powerful as amazons (if you did it right), and a payoff on the third turn, which makes them pretty far from a game breaker in my eyes.
      
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