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Caboose
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May 2004
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Foiled / Dispel Lore cards - used on/as Out of Character lore cards
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Fri, 24 August 2007 02:49
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In regards to Rogue's "Foiled" and Wizard's "Dispel Lore", the following situation occurred :
I was playing Warrior Strength (lore cost = 1). Since I didn't have any warrior levels, I paid 4 (3 more due to not having any levels).
My opponent played Rogue's Foiled...but also had no levels in Rogue.
Thus for my opponent, would he/she have to pay 4 or 5 lore??
Let me explain.
For 4, it would be the cost of the Strength (Lore = 1), which halved still equals 1, plus 3 more (1+3=4)
For 5, it would be the cost I used, 4, halved = 2. Plus 3 more (2+3 = 5)
And thus depending on the answer, would answer the other question of how much lore I get back due to the Foiled.
In the situation, I said it should be 5 lore he should spend, since I did pay 4 to play the card (and on the Foiled card, it does say "he gains back 1/2 the Lore he just spent").
Also it might be nice, since a person did have to spend more for casting a spell that is not in his/her WC, to not be able to get that back.
Obviously I was leaning to 4 lore for the Foiled, but the card states the above line. And was very hard to ignore that.
Cab
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germ
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June 2007
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Re:Foiled / Dispel Lore cards - used on/as Out of Character lore cards
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Fri, 24 August 2007 03:41
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I would opt for 4, since the Lore card says "You must pay 1/2 the Lore cost of the card" which is 1, (divided by 2, rounded back to 1) plus the extra 3 Lore since your opponent was playing the "foiled" card out-of character.
Even though you paid the extra 3 Lore to play the "Strength" card, the Lore cost of the card remains 1.
Would be a good idea to have this added to the card compendium.
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ColtsFan77
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February 2006
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Re:Foiled / Dispel Lore cards - used on/as Out of Character lore cards
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Fri, 24 August 2007 03:47
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This is already in the Lore Compendium under Dispel Lore. Last question.
It is based on the PRINTED value of the card, not what is actually PAID. So in your example, it should be 4 Lore to play Foiled!
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toddrew
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October 2006
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Caboose
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Re:Foiled / Dispel Lore cards - used on/as Out of Character lore cards
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Fri, 24 August 2007 06:26
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| ColtsFan76 wrote on Thu, 23 August 2007 19:47 |
This is already in the Lore Compendium under Dispel Lore. Last question.
It is based on the PRINTED value of the card, not what is actually PAID. So in your example, it should be 4 Lore to play Foiled!
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I thought I looked at them all...but wait..
Actually CF, the QUESTION that is the last one there, but there is NO Answer to the question!
Plus also it appears, in the question, the person seems to have the same "thought" as I did, for an out of character spell being cancelled, he says 4 lore back (cost of spell was 4 + 3 more = 7).
I sure hope it is the printed value and not the actual lore cost.
Since if it is out of character, you would think there be some penalty. And if both cards are out of character, it seems the
cancelling party will pay more, whereas the other player gets some benefit of getting some lore back.
But like I said, there are 2 issues :
1) The player who spell got cancelled, per the card text, gets 1/2 the lore spent
2) The player who is doing the cancelling, per card text, spends 1/2 the lore cost of the card.
(And both cards have the same text on them too!)
And thus if out of character, can be 2 different values for both.
Thus for my example above, if both are out of character, the Strength would cost 2 lore (net) while the Foiled would cost 4.
As a side note, it would be nice if both cards (Rogue's Foiled and Wizard's Dispel Lore) would have the same answer/questions underneath them [or somehow point to the other card]. As well as for other similiar cards as well. I know DoW has other things to work on but it would be nice as some point.
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ColtsFan77
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February 2006
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Re:Foiled / Dispel Lore cards - used on/as Out of Character lore cards
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Fri, 24 August 2007 13:00
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| Caboose wrote on Thu, 23 August 2007 23:26 |
| ColtsFan76 wrote on Thu, 23 August 2007 19:47 |
This is already in the Lore Compendium under Dispel Lore. Last question.
It is based on the PRINTED value of the card, not what is actually PAID. So in your example, it should be 4 Lore to play Foiled!
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I thought I looked at them all...but wait..
Actually CF, the QUESTION that is the last one there, but there is NO Answer to the question!
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Come on! I may have bad eyesight, but i am not blind! Here is the exact cut and paste:
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chrert says
2007-08-01 15:40:42
How much does it cost to dispel a card played out-of-character? (Comment / Question)
Question: Player A plays Magic Missile, a card with a normal cost of 4 lore. However, player A has no wizard on his council; he's playing it out-of-character and must pay an additional 3 lore for a total of 7 lore. Player B plays Dispel Lore to cancel the Magic Missile. Player A accordingly gains back half the lore he spent; 4 lore is returned to his cup. But how much does player B pay to play Dispel? Is "the Lore cost of the card" the cost printed on the card (i.e. 4, so a cost of 2 to dispel), or is it the actual cost to player A (i.e. 7, so a cost of 4 to dispel)?
Answer: The lore cost to discard the card played by player A is based on the Lore cost marked on the card, NOT including any supplemental cost due to player A having no Wizard. So in this example Player B would only have to pay 2 Lore to dispel the 7 Lore cost Magic Missile of Player A.
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(emphasis added)
This question and answer is for if Player A (you in your example) played out of character but Player B was in character. The important part is how do you deal with Player A - casting a spell out of character is handled. It tells Player B how much he should pay. Now you take it a step further and say Player B is out of character as well and automatically pays 3 Lore on top of the base cost.
Am I missing something?
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toddrew
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October 2006
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ColtsFan77
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February 2006
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Re:Foiled / Dispel Lore cards - used on/as Out of Character lore cards
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Fri, 24 August 2007 13:39
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toddrew, is caboose putting you up to this? 
I agree with your first paragraph and disagree with your second paragraph. Player A gets back 1/2 of what he SPENT - even half of the 3 Lore spent out of character according to the Compendium.
So to clarify using Cabooses's example:
Player A plays Strength out of character. It costs him 1 Lore (printed cost) + 3 Lore (out of character) for a total of 4 Lore.
Player B plays Dispel Lore out of character. It costs him 1 Lore (1/2 of the printed cost rounded up) + 3 Lore (out of character) for a total of 4 Lore.
Player A then recoups 2 Lore (1/2 of what he spent).
The card is quite clear in my opinion. It states the Opponent gets back "1/2 he just spent" and the Castere of Dispel Lore pays "1/2 the Lore cost of the card." The "cost" and what was "spent" are two different things in this case and clearly assigned to each player.
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toddrew
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October 2006
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Re:Foiled / Dispel Lore cards - used on/as Out of Character lore cards
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Fri, 24 August 2007 14:00
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| ColtsFan76 wrote on Fri, 24 August 2007 05:39 |
toddrew, is caboose putting you up to this?
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No, just thought he'd like a little company with being an ass with logic  (jk, Cab)
I've adopted some inaccurate assumptions over the time I've been playing and I don't know where I got the "out of character costs are not consider when resolving foiled/dispel" maxim - but upon inspection of the cards in question alone (hmm, rereading the card rather than going on memory, perhaps a practice I should adopt  ), it would be the player foiled getting back half of what they spent (printed cost + any out of character cost) rounded up, player foiling paying half of the foiled card's printed cost rounded up + any out of character costs. There, all in accord
[Aktualisiert am: Fri, 24 August 2007 14:28]
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ColtsFan77
Nachrichten: 3313
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February 2006
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Re:Foiled / Dispel Lore cards - used on/as Out of Character lore cards
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Fri, 24 August 2007 14:16
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| toddrew wrote on Fri, 24 August 2007 07:00 |
| ColtsFan76 wrote on Fri, 24 August 2007 05:39 |
toddrew, is caboose putting you up to this?
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No, just thought he'd like a little company with being an ass with logic (jk, Cab)
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lol Alright that put me back in a good mood. 
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Caboose
Nachrichten: 1623
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May 2004
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Re:Foiled / Dispel Lore cards - used on/as Out of Character lore cards
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Fri, 24 August 2007 16:21
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Well I'm using Firefox and I'm NOT seeing the Answer, just the question...so obviously something is amiss...HONEST!
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ColtsFan77
Nachrichten: 3313
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February 2006
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Re:Foiled / Dispel Lore cards - used on/as Out of Character lore cards
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Fri, 24 August 2007 16:23
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| Caboose wrote on Fri, 24 August 2007 09:21 |
Well I'm using Firefox and I'm NOT seeing the Answer, just the question...so obviously something is amiss...HONEST!
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OK. I thought I was in the twilight zone! Perhaps you need to clear your cache and refresh?
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Caboose
Nachrichten: 1623
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May 2004
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Re:Foiled / Dispel Lore cards - used on/as Out of Character lore cards
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Fri, 24 August 2007 16:23
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| ColtsFan76 wrote on Fri, 24 August 2007 06:16 |
| toddrew wrote on Fri, 24 August 2007 07:00 |
| ColtsFan76 wrote on Fri, 24 August 2007 05:39 |
toddrew, is caboose putting you up to this?
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No, just thought he'd like a little company with being an ass with logic (jk, Cab)
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lol Alright that put me back in a good mood.
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Look, let's not resort to name calling and all...even in jest on public forums..k?
Obviously my above post should clarify everything...since I'm NOT seeing the answer to the question...just the question.
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