Deep Blue Deep Blue

Forum

Suche
Forum » Memoir '44 - English » The board is 9 hexes deep...
Anzeigen: Heutige Nachrichten 
  
VerfasserThema
Sixter
Senior Member
Cadet

Fan-Seite
Nachrichten: 152
Registriert:
June 2006
The board is 9 hexes deep... Wed, 27 September 2006 11:54
Am I the only one who feels that the majority of scenarios don't make use of the larger part of the board?
Feels like most of the scenarios I have played lately have had the opposing forces in close proximity to each other.
The tendency is for those games to develop in the way that people engage in combat from turn 1 and don't look back till one side has reached the required medal count.
The battle range in Memoir44 is considerable so I would have thought it was quite important to make sure most of the map was in between the players, not behind them.
I can pick numerous examples from the official scenarios if anyone is interested in discussing this.
A lot of scenarios start with artillery within "2 dice" range of units that have their back against the wall for example.
It just feels like you're dropped right in the middle of the battle instead of giving you any chance to manouever your forces at all.
In many instances you play through the game and realize that you haven't used half the map at all! The map is pretty small to begin with in my opinion so I would think it's an absolute requirement for scenarios to make clever use of the whole board.

I don't own C&C Ancients but I looked through most of the scenarios that come with that game and it seemed like they started with at least 3 hexes between the forces in most cases. Range is less in that game so that means that usually there is some space left on the board between the armies before they engage. That's a vital aspect of the game in my opinion.
      
warwell
Junior Member
Second Lieutenant

Nachrichten: 23
Registriert:
June 2004
Re:The board is 9 hexes deep... Wed, 27 September 2006 14:10
On the positive side, the set-ups allow for quick action because you don't have to spend a lot of time maneuvering into position. This helps speed gameplay.
      
ColtsFan77
Senior Member

Fan-Seite
Nachrichten: 3313
Registriert:
February 2006
Re:The board is 9 hexes deep... Wed, 27 September 2006 15:23
Some people complain that this game can go defensive real quick. Each side digs in and the game lasts forever as each player builds his hand and refuses to make the first move.

I disagree with that statement, but some of the set-ups you mention force the action to happen much quicker. I like that. Sometimes it may feel that things happen to quickly and you would rather develop them a bit more. But real war doesn't always allow that so the simulation shouldn't either.

On the flip side of things, if you start with all your forces on the edge of the board, that could be devastating to you. You can still only activate the number of units based on the cards in hand. If you start with units backed up against the board, they have nowhere to retreat. Now flags become as deadly as hits.

One of the worst games I had was a SFTF where I had about 8 to 10 INF starting in the first two rows on my side of the board. Though I had the superior number of forces, I couldn't get them moved into the action quick enough. Once the enemey advanced, it was like cattle to the slaughter. My forces were mowed down. Next time I played, I had to move my INF before that happened again and it took a while to get things going.

So just because you put the maximum space between you doesn't always make for a better game.

(As a side note, this is devastating in Battle Cry. In that game, a unit forced to retreat off the side of the board does not just lose one figure, it loses the whole unit and it counts as victory flag for your opponent. And if that unit has a general, they both retreat, both coutn as seperate flags. I have played games where units started on the edge. The first roll of the game forced the unit & general off the board with a retreat and you are staring at a 0-2 flag deficit before you play your first card.)
      
Sixter
Senior Member
Cadet

Fan-Seite
Nachrichten: 152
Registriert:
June 2006
Re:The board is 9 hexes deep... Wed, 27 September 2006 16:26
I agree that it probably comes down to scenario preference, people prefer different things.

However, I feel like I have to bring up one scenario that simply does not make any sense because of how the board is utilized:

Iwo-Jima: The Meat Grinder
I have to say that this scenario almost feels retarded.
The US forces on their left flank are basically like fish in a barrel, squeezed between a minefield and the back edge of the board. Still within 2 dice range of Jap artillery and 1 die range of their front infantry, all flags basically counting as kills under the circumstances. Who was the dumb general in charge if this is supposed to reflect the battle at all? It's almost as if the US forces are supposed to be surrounded and are making a suicidal attempt to get out.

A number of scenarios have the defender positioned very much forward and the attacker stacked on the first two rows of his side of the board, both forces already within range.
Often it forces your actions as the attacker and I don't see how that can be positive, especially since the defense often has a forced playout sort of. Then it all comes down to luck.

I stumbled upon a post the other day at the Battlecry forum at the Boardgamegeek.
The quote is from a guy who claimed he got 2nd place at the Battlecry tourny at the last World Boardgaming Championship. I hope he doesn't mind me using the quote...

"The cards play a lesser role the farther apart the armies are. In scenarios where the armies are in the open, or on top of each other, whoever gets the better cards early is MUCH MUCH more likely to win. I wish the WBC final game would have had the armies much farther separated so that the final two players would have had room to maneuver their armies and balance out the cards rather than shoot it out in a point blank gunfight with the winner being the one who could shoot the most (i.e. have the strongest initial cards.)"
      
Cantatta
Senior Member
Arnhem Victory

Fan-Seite
Nachrichten: 432
Registriert:
May 2005
Re:The board is 9 hexes deep... Fri, 29 September 2006 18:28
Might I suggest doing some preliminary recon and find the scenarios that suit your style of play? There are a myriad of scenarios, from official to user-made that offer many and varied types of battles, from close combat to artillery duels. I can tell you that I don't care for all the scenarios I've seen, and I've played some I don't much like, either. However, those scenarios still have their place, especially if they are depicting an historical situation.

As for the problem of enemy combatants starting in too-close proximity, sometimes it cannot be avoided due to the very limitation of board size you mentioned, namely the 9 hex depth of the board. 9 hexes is not a lot of room to begin with, and if you take 3 rows away just to provide breathing room between armies, you are down to 3 rows for deploying your army and 3 rows for the enemy army, again not much room to work with.

I will agree that the game board is cramped in C&C games. One solution I've found that works for me and my play group, I found a place to buy large felt terrain mats printed with 2" hexes, and they are something like 3'x4' in size, roughly 13-hexes by 17-hexes or something like that. I have two different mats, one in tan, or desert, and one in green. We use this to create larger battles, but they are often just existing scenarios with minor adjustments for the larger playing area. You can get even bigger mats if you desire (for mo' money), but the mats I bought have worked out quite well. Below is the website for the mats in question, if you have any interest.

Monday Knight Games - http://www.mondayknight.com/MKP-Mats.htm

That will take you directly to the page where you can choose terrain mats with various sizes of hexes printed on them. M44 and the other C&C games use 2" hexes, so best to stick with that size, IMO. Hope this helps!
      
Scragnoth
Senior Member
D-Day Recon Team - Silver

Fan-Seite
Nachrichten: 194
Registriert:
October 2005
Re:The board is 9 hexes deep... Fri, 29 September 2006 22:47
ofcourse you can allways create an overlord scenario where you move from left to right (or vice versa).

I guess its plenty of space then. Just more narrow but you'll get your depth. Very Happy

In a previous topic I already mentioned that 1 vs 1 Overlord is very attractive and I'm surprised not more players mention it and that the number of overlord scenario's is still 1/30th of the total.
Give it a try ... it takes just a little longer Razz

[Aktualisiert am: Fri, 29 September 2006 22:48]

      
    
Vorheriges Thema:Blowing up bridges question
Nächstes Thema:So was the Pacific Expansion worth it?
Gehen Sie zum Forum: