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paulvbrown
Junior Member

Posts: 20
Registered:
December 2005
STOLEN [originally Secret] Orders, units "equal to command" Sun, 17 February 2008 09:18
Well, this one may be clear as day to everyone else, but when a new player asked me this one recently I had to claim ignorance.

He played STOLEN [originally Secret] Orders, and grabbed some sort of Advance card, which allows him to order as many units as he has command cards "INCLUDING THIS ONE". He had a level 2 commander, thus NORMALLY 5 cards, but having played Secret Orders he was now sitting there with a total of 6.

He had exactly 6 units in the section in question, so I let him have it at 6, but ultimately wasn't sure.

Now I *THINK* that the basic rules explain this on p. 11:
"..is marked as Equal to Command, then the # of units a player may order is equal to the # of Command cards in the player's possession (including the Command card currently being played). This is usually the same # of Command cards that the player started the game with, per the adventure's battle notes."

I don't really believe that could be any more clear -- 6 was the correct answer in this case. Any differing opinions?

[Updated on: Sun, 17 February 2008 11:58]

      
Tsugo
Member

Posts: 95
Registered:
January 2007
Re:Secret Orders, units "equal to command" Sun, 17 February 2008 09:49
There is no card called Secret Orders. If he played a Lore Card in lieu of a Command card, his level of command would not change. If his level of command was 5 then that's how many he can activate.
      
paulvbrown
Junior Member

Posts: 20
Registered:
December 2005
Re:STOLEN Orders, units "equal to command" Sun, 17 February 2008 11:56
Right - Stolen Orders is obviously the card I was referring to. Sorry - thought it sounded wrong, but didn't bother to check it. Your argument isn't very convincing, though. Any rules references or anything to back it up?
      
affro
Member

User Pages
Posts: 72
Registered:
January 2007
Re:STOLEN Orders, units "equal to command" Sun, 17 February 2008 13:36
I'd second Tsugo explanation, first and foremost for a friendly, not "rule-lawing" interpretation of the rule. However, by stretching a little bit even the "letter" of the rule, putting aside what I think is "the spirit", Tsugo'sexplanation remains convincing to me.

I understand that the ambiguity rises from the use of the verb "play" in the text of Stolen Orders Lore Card, which says
"Select one Command card from the discard pile, and play it."; but the Lore Card states also explicitely "Play in lieau of a Command Card", so the Card taken from the discard pile cannot be considered really played "as a command card", it's only the effect of the Lore Card (a little paradoxical, but I think this is right); it's more like the emulation of an old arcade machine on a modern pc, "It's the same, but not quite so"...).

More so, the text you rightly quoted states:

"the # of units a player may order is equal to the # of Command cards in the player's possession(including the Command card currently being played)"

I'd point to the fact that even if a Command Card is currently being played via Stolen Orders, it never really came into possession of the player, ye, in his hand or from his hand into play . Neither the hand is refreshed after the use of the Stolen Order.

Your doubt is legitimate seeing thow the text adds "This is usually the same # of Command cards that the player started the game with", but I think this refers to the situations where a special condition of the Scenario may oblige a player to reduce or augment his hand to simulate reinforcements, army's morale, coming of dusk, etc etc...
Also, the phrasing on the Command Card itself in this case does not seem particulary happy, but it's a slightly convoluted coincidence...

Just my two cents...


[Updated on: Sun, 17 February 2008 13:48]

      
ColtsFan77
Senior Member

User Pages
Posts: 3313
Registered:
February 2006
Re:STOLEN [originally Secret] Orders, units "equal to command" Sun, 17 February 2008 15:39
The rules don't help because they only count the number in your hand plus the number in play. So you have a strong case, based on this wording, to say it was 6.

However, another way of saying "equal to command" is how many command cards you are allowed to hold (page 11). This is a function of your Commander level (L) in BattleLore - which is 3+L. This can be affected by certain situations such as when you are forced to loose a Command Card because your Stronghold was captured. These are very specific. So based on this, equal to Command is 5.

I would have ruled the Command is 5. Stolen Orders does not artificially increase your Command rating.
      
Caboose
Senior Member
First Lieutenant

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Posts: 1628
Registered:
May 2004
Re:STOLEN [originally Secret] Orders, units "equal to command" Tue, 19 February 2008 22:15
As a game guide, I would have said 5 command cards like Colt said above.

Even though the player has 6 currently via the Stolen Order lore card, the player normally holds 5 command cards. Through the function of the lore card played, the player was able to obtain a command card from the discard pile to play. Even though that increased the # of command cards briefly to 6, it should be 5 units to order.

Since if the command card had come from the player's hand, it would have been 5 units. It should be no different via playing the Stolen Orders lore card.

Cab
      
    
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