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*player24262
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Ranking Tue, 31 May 2005 23:13
Hi all

I am in a very strange strange state of mind about the ranking.I have very disconcerting feelings that I'd like to explain and I'd like to know if some other players feel the same.

I began playing in december as a guest (the ranking was not a problem for me of course) but I decided to become a real player( so that I can create games).

At that time, I really had much fun playing; I enjoyed playing with friends, I enjoyed drawing 12 tickets and complete them all, I enjoyed winning with a real fair play. I didn't mind when I was losing a game.And of course, I enjoyed getting better and better ranked and I began playing rather well.

But one day, a good friend of mine told me he didn't want to play me anymore because I was winning too often .That made me feel sad : chose between rank and friends: what a choice ! Sad

In the meantime, I met a very good, very nice and top ranked player Love . We played a lot of games. I learned to play like him and I got even better .

But one day, that player told me that I was playing too well and that he was losing too many points against me because I was lower ranked than him and that made me feel sad again Sad

Then I tried to get better ranked and I reached the 16th place . Very Happy

But since that, my state of mind hasn't been the same : now, I play to win, and only to win. If I have to crush my opponent, I do it. Someone told me that I have a reputation of being a blocker ( yes yes, me, a blocker Laughing Laughing )In each game, I'm very stressed because I'm afraid to lose points and get down in the ranking. And as I'm stressed , I lose ! Sad

I even hesitate to play, I'm so much afraid to lose my precious points ! You can see it in my history : I could play 40 games a day Shocked ( a day off, of course Wink ) and now, I rarely play more than 5 games a day ! Sad

I really don't have fun anymore when I play and I hate that feeling, it is not me. I am someone who likes to have fun in everything. Then, if there is no fun when I play, why do I play ? Rolling Eyes


I'd like to take a decision : to stop playing for the ranking !

My score would probably fall down but I want to have fun again when I play !

Some ( I have names in mind Wink )will say I'm a loser : perhaps !

Do other players have the same feelings ?

thank you for your answers

      
yaron
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Re:Ranking Tue, 31 May 2005 23:58
Perhaps we should ask for an option to have non-ranked games.

Then you could play seriously when you're in the mood, and not seriously when you're not. Or you could play non-ranked games against those people who don't play you because of points.

Of course, I've really avoided the question of what to do in the current situation, but I don't think I have a good solution for that question Sad

Yaron
      
thadd
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Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 00:21
Dear Lea!!!

I feel the same way, i played a lot games just drawing tickets and trying to complete them. If I was able to complete them all (once 225 pts!) it was a great feeling. But at a certain moment, i think it was when i played the first time with you ( and Orc) you asked me about my rank and i had no clue which rank i had (about 700, i looked it up). And then my hunterinstinct woke up and i really played for better scores.

Now I try to find a "juste milieu", I still play a lot of games but I try to avoid losing in a much harder way (blocking, taking the 6s, etc...).

For the moment i am ok with that, and I will continue to play like that. Who knows how long this game will continue to be a challenge for me.
But a very important part of this game is the community, which made me meet people from all over the world.

And so I play a lot of games with the same persons, and then you begin to lose also quite often.
But that doesn't matter to me.
This is the reason that I will never be a top 10 player. Sans regret!

Cu
Thad
      
Rode katers
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Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 00:24
Dear leachris

Like I already told you I kinda recognize your problem. Since I started to really understand the game I have gone up in the ranking to a top100 place. Since then i check my ranking after each game, get nervous when i play a good opponent and sometimes see some games more as work then as leisure. I want to be in the top 50 and I play for that. Fun is less important. That is kind of sad, come to think of it Confused Confused Confused Confused

There is nothing wrong with having goals, even when you do something for pleasure. But when the goal is becoming the only factor and the pleasure is gone, it is time to stop and wonder.

I might sound quite intelligent, but I will not listen to myself. Because I will reach that top 50 d... it!!!

BTW Lea I hope this will not mean that I will see you less in the lobby from now on. I liked the games with you and loved the chat

Pur
Rode katers

[Mis à jour le: Wed, 01 June 2005 14:43]

      
*player24262
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Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 01:04
Rode katers écrit le Wed, 01 June 2005 00:24

BTW Lea I hope this will niot mean that I will see you less in the lobby from now on. I liked the games with you and loved the chat



NO NO NO, I'll still be there , you won't get rid of me so easily Laughing Laughing


I think I need to stand aloof with all that and things will be better !

And I love our chat too Wink

kiss !

      
thekid
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Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 01:27
To me winning is fun and losing is not fun. That is the motivation to keep on winning. If you rise higher in the ranks then everyone will want to play you, because they think they can get some extra points. This provides extra motivation to keep winning.
      
*player39229
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Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 04:03
Let me tell you a story from my days playing tournament chess.

Back in my teens, I was quite a good player, for my age and experience. I wasn't winning tournaments outright, as the tournaments I played were usually being won by the local International Masters and such, and it usually takes decades of play to get to that level, but I was regularly taking divisional prizes. I was probably walking away with a cash prize one tournament out of two, meaning that my hobby more than paid for itself.

So one day, I decided to take my play to the next level, to become a true competitor rather than just playing for a bit of fun. I determined that I would win my division in the tournament I was scheduled to play.

However, on the day, I played very badly. For a low-rated player, losing the first round of a Swiss-draw tournament is to be expected, but it was still disappointing because I had always been a "giant-killer", upsetting high-rated players surprisingly often. The second round was a more even match, so I counted myself capable of the victory, and yet I lost dismally. The third round, I played against someone I should have beaten easily, and yet I made numerous errors and was lucky to scrape a draw.

By the morning, I knew that my ambition would remain unfulfilled. With a score of only 0.5 after three rounds of a five-round tournament, I had virtually no chance of winning. I resigned myself to defeat, and decided to play the last two rounds for fun, rather than in hopes of a prize. I was suprised to find that I had been drawn against a tougher opponent than in the third round, but that was okay, because it would make the game more fun.

I then played two brilliant games against worthy opponents, and had a ball. The fact that I won both games seemed incidental to me.

Then, when the prizes were announced, it turned out that the other players in my division had also had a bad tournament, and there was a large tie on 2 points. My 2.5 points was the division top, ahead of something like eight players on 2. I had won by the draw.

That was the first and last time I ever played for a tournament win. Ever after, I played for the joy of playing. I still won a lot of games, and a lot of divisions, but I never made the mistake of harming my play and my enjoyment with thoughts of anything but the game at hand.

Eventually I gave up chess tournaments in favour of regular roleplaying, including conventions. I didn't have enough weekends for both, and I went with the hobby that I was finding most fun. I win less prizes, and never any money, and there's no rating system for roleplayers (or none that anybody worthwhile in Australian roleplaying doesn't scoff at), but I still enjoy my gaming.

Take from that what you will.
      
ElSoyokaze
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Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 05:50
Rating gives me a reason to try.

I play the games for the competition and the pushing of myself. In order to do that, I need to play good players and beat them. This also boosts my rank, so I'm not exactly sure which comes first, but still, losing ranks means I'm doing poorly and should do better.

Really, though, I just want to be recognized. I don't have a goal of being in the top ten or anything; I'm rather content with my position. But as long as I can play well and be respected as I respect the other top players is enough for me, but I wouldn't want to (couldn't) be in that position as a 2000-ranked player.

I guess I can't empathize with you, léa, because playing an opponent who doesn't care if they take a track longer than three trains or block me, regardless of how many points I score, just isn't fun because it's not challenging.

Of course, I don't play much as is, but that's just how I feel about the matter.

--ElSoy
      
Griselda
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Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 08:49
"There is nothing wrong with having goals, even when you do something for pleasure. But when the goal is becoming the only factor and the pleasure is gone, it is time to stop and wonder."
Great Rode katers!!

Thanks Lea - this is the best thread for a long time.

You explain exactly how I feel about the game the last weeks. I played such a lot at the beginning - once it was 50 games a day. The last days often just 4 or 5.... ( OK, OK - chatting increased...).
Maybe it is a solution to play a guest-account ( Lea-just-for-fun )to avoid that the gain or loss of points is open. Yesterday I read a great theory about a 4-player strategy and I wanted to play that way. So I logged in with Fabians guest-account and it was great fun to PLAY. Without being afraid to lose even more points after the black day I had yesterday.

I m gonna take my brothers web-card and create 4Gris ( my second identity for 4-player games ) the next days, so I can open games without pressure. You re welcome to play with any guest account. And if you want to play competitive - ask for Griselda.

And: 4 PLAYER IS FUN ! TRY IT AGAIN SOMETIMES!



      
piratedwarf
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Marco Polo

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Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 09:46
I guess I play with a quite different style, but to me the ranking is not a problem. Currently ranked only as 228. so maybe I don't have that much to worry about, but then I don't play that many games, perhaps one or two per day.

I mostly enjoy playing 3- or 4-player games, and I mostly create games anyone (with good karma) can join. So I play anyone who wants to play, and most of the time those people tend to be easy to beat. But I really do enjoy it when sometimes a really good player is in the play and beats the heck out of me.

Obviously, in a multiplayer game, sometimes you lose just because of coincidence - the other players non-intentionally happen to block your way and that kind of stuff. Though I would say it's just a matter of adapting to the situation - and I think I've managed to get somewhat good at that, and atleast that is my mission.

Actually I think that the game may even become harder when some player quits (or maybe they have technical problems) and there's a DumbBot in play, since you really can't anticipate what it's going to do. Most probably it wouldn't win, but it can affect quite much on who is going to.

Anyway, I really don't take stress with winning, though I play to win. If someone calls me during a game, they won't get an answer Wink

To me it seems the 2-player is a bit dull, since it's quite mathematic in some way - but then I really don't enjoy any two-player games that much. I really love the multiplayer games with the everchanging situation and the surprises.

But in some way I do have the same problem, not that my rank would be it, but my friends rarely like to play the board game anymore with me, even though they did for starters. I think it's because I win them too often, which isn't that surprising when taking to account that they probably haven't played over 10 games.

I don't know, should I play "easy" with them, and sometimes I do, but then it's not that much fun for me - and they do also play competitive, and they don't like it either if they smell the rats. Wink

Maybe there should be some sort of "handicap", you know, that would make the game a bit more difficult for the more experienced player. Maybe you would get less tickets and train cards in the beginning or something. Obviously with this I mostly mean the board game. Any suggestions?


-piratzwergen
      
Angel 6
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  Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 10:00
Hi léachris,

thank you very much for your post, I feel exactly like you!

Look at my history, at the beginning I played throughout my whole spare time, but since January I play only sporadically - for the reasons you wrote.

Also, that is the reason I sometimes play with the Katzenfrau-account. As Katzenfrau I have no pressure at all and thus much more fun.

I'd like to lose my competitiveness...
      
*player24262
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Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 10:14
hello all, and thank you for all your kind answers
thaddäus
thaddäus écrit le Wed, 01 June 2005 00:21

I play a lot of games with the same persons, and then you begin to lose also quite often.

same for me
yaron
yaron écrit le Tue, 31 May 2005 23:58

Perhaps we should ask for an option to have non-ranked games.
Then you could play seriously when you're in the mood, and not seriously when you're not. Or you could play non-ranked games against those people who don't play you because of points.


That would be a good and a bad idea :
If I still win , the players who don't want to play me because they lose all the games will go on losing !
And the ones who care about points won't play non ranked games !

Rode katers
Rode katers écrit le Wed, 01 June 2005 00:24


There is nothing wrong with having goals, even when you do something for pleasure. But when the goal is becoming the only factor and the pleasure is gone, it is time to stop and wonder.


the voice of wisdom Wink

cu very soon kitty !

thekid:thanks for your respectful answer;perhaps the great guy someone told me about could appear Razz

tjandjahall: thanks for sharing your experience, I feel less stupid Wink
Sosy:
ElSoyokaze écrit le Wed, 01 June 2005 05:50

But as long as I can play well and be respected as I respect the other top players is enough for me, but I wouldn't want to (couldn't) be in that position as a 2000-ranked player.


I felt the same when I began getting up in rank , I was proud to become one of the top , though I was losing my other partners.
But let me tell you, before februray, I was a guest, only playing for fun.
I had played GoF for months (since june) as a guest. But I was respected because people knew I played well, and was someone interesting and kind ( one minute of self satisfaction Wink )

Then why should that change ???
Griselda:
Griselda écrit le Wed, 01 June 2005 08:49

Thanks Lea - this is the best thread for a long time. I played such a lot at the beginning - once it was 50 games a day. The last days often just 4 or 5.... ( OK, OK - chatting increased...).


The same for me Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing

Quote:


Maybe it is a solution to play a guest-account ( Lea-just-for-fun )to avoid that the gain or loss of points is open. Yesterday I read a great theory about a 4-player strategy and I wanted to play that way. So I logged in with Fabians guest-account and it was great fun to PLAY. Without being afraid to lose even more points after the black day I had yesterday.


I do have another account ( my husband's one , he never plays Sad )

But that's not a solution for me , it would only be to keep my points on the "official" account and I would be as stressed as I am now when I would play with the "official" account.

Someone told me on msn that my thread is very sad, but don't worry for me...
I've been through a difficult period, much work, tired.
Last wedenesday, after several very hurting experiences with several players her ( not only loss !!! ), I wanted to give up the game and wrote it on the forum but there are so many wonderful people here, I won't let them all , I stay !!!
But I'm almost on holidays then I'll feel better in few days !!! Very Happy Very Happy


thanks again for all your kinf answers

[Mis à jour le: Wed, 01 June 2005 10:23]

      
Peter de Zeeuw
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Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 10:24
I don't want to sound like a sexist, so PLEASE don't take this the wrong way; but this is mainly a girl problem.

I play board games with my mother, my brother and his girlfriend. Whenever me and my brother get fanatic and competitive, we notice that my mother and his girlfriend are losing interest in the game. They still play their game, but they don't have much fun anymore. I also noticed that if they pull off a good strategic stunt to tease us a little bit, and we act (read again: ACT) like we're a little pissed, that they are sorry for it and the rest of the game they won't bother us again.

It's sad that it goes that way. And I feel sad I've been such a jerk... Sad

But it proofs once again an undeniable truth: men and women differ from each other. Girl are much more sensitive than boys. And that's not a bad thing. Heck, no! I love it! It's up to us boys to be a little less fanatic.

Léachris, FUN should be the number one thing around here, and Rode Katers said it best. It's my goal to be number 1 around here. Cocky? Arrogant? Sure. Whatever. But at least I'm having FUN. And unlike some others, I enjoy playing 4 and even 5 players games and even when I've reached my goal I won't stop playing them.

Take care Léa, and don't let anyone steal your fun,

D.I.S. (one of those wonderful people around here and the reason why you should stay Grin )
      
pilke
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Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 12:46
I change goals and my attitude to rank and score every now and then to keep me happy and to keep me interested in the game.

When I started here with the pilke account, I had played only a few board games before that. I didn't learn it that fast and in the beginning I lost even to the robots and went from Huoston to Duluth straight up in the middle. Wink I just played for fun, but then it started to be a little boring. So I wanted to challenge myself to be a better player. I got tips from the forum and I tried out some of my own methods (some ok, some not so good).
And I started to learn and rise in rank. I made a goal to be someday in top 100, after that in top 40 and then finally in the first page of the rankinglist. The goals gave me nice excitement towards the game and kept me intrested in playing a lot. I gave up playing 4-player games, that seemed to have bigger luck factor.

When I reached top 20, I started to look more score than the rank. There were big differences in score between players in top 20, so it was more interesting that way. I wanted to progress, so I made a rule, that I won't play if I don't have time to play my way to the same score, I started that day (if I dropped).

I mostly played with not so good score people, I thought it was the easiest way to get the points that way (and I didn't know the good ranked people here then). There became at least two score points, that I had very much difficulties to pass. If I remember correctly I got stuck in 1774 and then I always dropped. Then I finally reached 1799 (my goal was 1800) and dropped from there too. During that long way up from 1700 to 1799, I got bored with playing against bad players. It just didn't give me any challenge any more. So I desided to give up the goal 1800 and desided my next goal would be to be a better player against those who block. So I asked the best blockers I knew (thekid and rek) to play with me a lot. I stopped looking the score and rank then. I played and I learned and I somehow got even somewhere between 1815-1820. (I don't remember the exact score because I didn't watch score then so much) Then one day I was sick and at home and played a lot with Anu and Womble and lost a lot and lost a lot of score. (I lost because they were really good, not because I got a cold) After that I have had a goal to to be close to 1800, and if I drop, I always change my goal to 1775. (And I would change it to 1750 if I would drop under 1775). That way I have always reached my goal and can be a happy player Wink (I am weird, ain't I Very Happy ) I haven't much looked the rank, because there haven't been any people who have about same score. (except now wernerus and I don't want to start to compete with unfair players. so I will forget the ranking game)

I will keep having those goals with pilke, until I get bored, and then I have to quit playing or come up with an other goal. Biggest thing now that keeps me want to play with pilke, is to get to play with my nice internetfriends. Smile

With tiuku my goals were to learn how the provisional state works. and to be in top 100 and maybe in top 20 too. After that I might start to play 3-5-player games with tiuku.

OH, this became much longer than I thought! ...but I wrote it, so I will send it.

[Mis à jour le: Wed, 01 June 2005 13:44]

      
Rode katers
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Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 14:38
Peter de Zeeuw wrote on Wed, 01 June 2005:

I don't want to sound like a sexist, so PLEASE don't take this the wrong way; but this is mainly a girl problem.

I now start to question my gender!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks a lot Peter Mad Mad Mad Mad Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy

Pur
Rode katers

[Mis à jour le: Wed, 01 June 2005 15:53]

      
SKMorefield
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Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 15:02
Peter de Zeeuw wrote on Wed, 01 June 2005 04:24

I don't want to sound like a sexist, so PLEASE don't take this the wrong way; but this is mainly a girl problem.

I play board games with my mother, my brother and his girlfriend. Whenever me and my brother get fanatic and competitive, we notice that my mother and his girlfriend are losing interest in the game. They still play their game, but they don't have much fun anymore. I also noticed that if they pull off a good strategic stunt to tease us a little bit, and we act (read again: ACT) like we're a little pissed, that they are sorry for it and the rest of the game they won't bother us again.

It's sad that it goes that way. And I feel sad I've been such a jerk... Sad

But it proofs once again an undeniable truth: men and women differ from each other. Girl are much more sensitive than boys. And that's not a bad thing. Heck, no! I love it! It's up to us boys to be a little less fanatic.

Léachris, FUN should be the number one thing around here, and Rode Katers said it best. It's my goal to be number 1 around here. Cocky? Arrogant? Sure. Whatever. But at least I'm having FUN. And unlike some others, I enjoy playing 4 and even 5 players games and even when I've reached my goal I won't stop playing them.

Take care Léa, and don't let anyone steal your fun,

D.I.S. (one of those wonderful people around here and the reason why you should stay Grin )




Thanks Leachris for the very interesting and introspective thread. Everyone, and I mean EVERYONE who has posted to this thread has had an interesting take on the issue. This has been fun to read.

Dang Peter!! Way to stir up the pot with a little TRUTH... thanks, buddy! Not putting women down at all, because we all know there are exceptions to every 'generalization' and some women are VERY competitive and of course some men are not, your basic point about men and women being different is a fundamental truth which has often been overlooked/ignored in this age of Political Correctness.

When I started playing my wife and I played with the same account. The K in my nickname is for Kim. We played some multi-player and some 2 player and lost a LOT. Then I started playing lots more (mostly because I can go home on my lunch break and sometimes stay up later) and began to move up in the rankings. I told my wife my goal was to reach top 500, then it would be OK after that. Then it was top 200, then top 100, etc. Well, that happened and it wasn't enough. I had to have more, then more... and my wife just laughed at me but she wasn't surprised, because she knows as a man I am naturally competitive. I even got her a different account when we bought Queen's Necklace, so she would not lose me points. (Even though I have taught her all I know and she is almost as 'good' as me, not that I'm 'all that' or anything... Rolling Eyes) She likes to win too, but a loss doesn't bug her nearly as much as it does me. A loss annoys me to no end, and afterwards I am analyzing every detail. Anyway, as to men and women, as Leachris might say, VIVE LE DIFFERENCE!! (did I spell that right Lea?) Wink

At any rate, sure the rankings make me nervous. I mean, in a close match my hands are all sweaty and I completely ignore my wife and crying baby... Crying or Very Sad Wink well not totally, but I understand the tension that the rankings and the stress to move up them create. As I write this I am ranked 20, highest I've ever been, which isn't anything compared to a lot of you but is a personal best for me. I know every time I get 'out there' I am putting that on the line, because usually a loss will cost me 7 points and several spots. But I keep doing it because in a way the competition itself is addictive.

In 'real life' I play local league tennis, for the SAME reason, the competition. I love beating people and I HATE losing, but more than anything i love just being out there, putting it on the line. Sure it's fun playing with friends, but when your RECORD is on the line, it's even more thrilling and fulfilling!! I'm not especially athletic or gifted, but I am a man, and generally men are hard-wired this way. God did it, not me!! Smile

I do understand people wanting to take a 'break' and play with a guest account or other low-ranked one sometimes just to relieve the stress, but I would never want to be a Stefan or Mary and play dumbots for months on end just to keep my ranking, or a Wernerous and get it unfairly.

However, as a last word I would caution everyone to avoid the temptation to use a guest account to 'bring down' a top ranked player, or boost your own account. Take Pilke's and Br'er Rabbit's example and honesty to heart about their second accounts. It's OK if done honestly!


Best,
SKM
      
*player24262
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Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 16:00
SKMorefield écrit le Wed, 01 June 2005 15:02

Thanks Leachris for the very interesting and introspective thread. Everyone, and I mean EVERYONE who has posted to this thread has had an interesting take on the issue. This has been fun to read.
thank you, but I really needed to know how other players felt about that.
Quote:

Anyway, as to men and women, as Leachris might say, VIVE LE DIFFERENCE!! (did I spell that right Lea?) Wink


PERFECT

Quote:

I mean, in a close match my hands are all sweaty and I completely ignore my wife and crying baby... Crying or Very Sad Wink
same for me Embarassed

Never sweaty hands but accelerated heart beatings and no more kids or husband !
Quote:

I keep doing it because in a way the competition itself is addictive.


For me, the game itself was addictive ! the competition destroyed that ! Sad

Quote:


I'm not especially athletic or gifted, but I am a man, and generally men are hard-wired this way. God did it, not me!! Smile

Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing
Quote:

However, as a last word I would caution everyone to avoid the temptation to use a guest account to 'bring down' a top ranked player, or boost your own account. Take Pilke's and Br'er Rabbit's example and honesty to heart about their second accounts. It's OK if done honestly!


You know, only a few players ( the ones who read the forum) knew about these accounts.
I talked once with someone who didn't know about it and found unfair from a top player to play with a low ranked account ( he lost many points in one game ! )!

Don't worry, if I decide to play with a guest account, either it will be with anonymous, or with people I know and who will know it.

      
*player82999
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March 2005
Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 16:08
This is a very interesting post...I started the br'er rabbit account as a guest account 1) to experiment with different strategies (mainly blocking) and 2)because I did stress myself out about games on my regular account. I wasn't really very good at this point anyways, so there was no risk of screwing up people's rankings. Anyways, I found myself doing much better on my guest account playing a little less competitively. My competitive nature took over and I couldn't resist finding out the rank on this account (as I had no excel account to figure these numbers), since then I can't stop playing competitively. Sure it's stressful at times, but that's part of the fun...it is just a game. Although I do analyze the crap out of a loss as sk mentioned (he's been the cause of several of those Smile . I think SK and Peter are right, that "in general" men are much more competitive. My wife usually only wants to play T2R Europe with me anymore, as I have much less experience. Let's just say it could be a lonely night on the sofa if I pulled any "intentional" blocking stunts. To the rest...I am not so merciful!
      
*player97287
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April 2005
Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 16:55
léachris wrote:

Quote:

Anyway, as to men and women, as Leachris might say, VIVE LE DIFFERENCE!! (did I spell that right Lea?) Wink


PERFECT

If by perfect you mean that only one word out of three is incorrect, then yes, it's perfect Very Happy

SKMorefield wrote:

However, as a last word I would caution everyone to avoid the temptation to use a guest account to 'bring down' a top ranked player, or boost your own account. Take Pilke's and Br'er Rabbit's example and honesty to heart about their second accounts. It's OK if done honestly!

I find even the idea of a second account to be borderline cheating. First because it seems unnatural to register two accounts to the same person. Also, if you want to practice something, why shouldn't it reflect in your "real" rank after all?

The problem of messing with points was raised. I understand the idea of training (against bots or against volunteers) but practicing with unknowing, real players and modifying their score as a result while your real score is preserved, isn't that against the spirit of the scores? The basic principle is an exchange of points between the winner and the loser.

So yeah, a second account is acceptable if you only play against people who know about it, but how many people limit themselves to that?

I don't think this opinion is widely spread around here but hey.
      
Peter de Zeeuw
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March 2005
Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 17:07
SKMorefield wrote:

When I started playing my wife and I played with the same account. The K in my nickname is for Kim. We played some multi-player and some 2 player and lost a LOT. Then I started playing lots more (mostly because I can go home on my lunch break and sometimes stay up later) and began to move up in the rankings. I told my wife my goal was to reach top 500, then it would be OK after that. Then it was top 200, then top 100, etc. Well, that happened and it wasn't enough. I had to have more, then more... and my wife just laughed at me but she wasn't surprised, because she knows as a man I am naturally competitive. I even got her a different account when we bought Queen's Necklace, so she would not lose me points. (Even though I have taught her all I know and she is almost as 'good' as me, not that I'm 'all that' or anything... Rolling Eyes) She likes to win too, but a loss doesn't bug her nearly as much as it does me. A loss annoys me to no end, and afterwards I am analyzing every detail. Anyway, as to men and women, as Leachris might say, VIVE LE DIFFERENCE!! (did I spell that right Lea?) Wink

At any rate, sure the rankings make me nervous. I mean, in a close match my hands are all sweaty and I completely ignore my wife and crying baby... Crying or Very Sad Wink well not totally, but I understand the tension that the rankings and the stress to move up them create. As I write this I am ranked 20, highest I've ever been, which isn't anything compared to a lot of you but is a personal best for me. I know every time I get 'out there' I am putting that on the line, because usually a loss will cost me 7 points and several spots. But I keep doing it because in a way the competition itself is addictive.

In 'real life' I play local league tennis, for the SAME reason, the competition. I love beating people and I HATE losing, but more than anything i love just being out there, putting it on the line. Sure it's fun playing with friends, but when your RECORD is on the line, it's even more thrilling and fulfilling!! I'm not especially athletic or gifted, but I am a man, and generally men are hard-wired this way. God did it, not me!! Smile



You made it even clearer, SKMorefield. Thanks for that.

And, uhm, Rode Katers... MAINLY a "girl problem". Take no offense. Wink

D.I.S.
      
*player82999
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March 2005
Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 17:21
redPEPPER wrote on Wed, 01 June 2005 10:55

léachris wrote:

Quote:

Anyway, as to men and women, as Leachris might say, VIVE LE DIFFERENCE!! (did I spell that right Lea?) Wink


PERFECT

If by perfect you mean that only one word out of three is incorrect, then yes, it's perfect Very Happy

SKMorefield wrote:

However, as a last word I would caution everyone to avoid the temptation to use a guest account to 'bring down' a top ranked player, or boost your own account. Take Pilke's and Br'er Rabbit's example and honesty to heart about their second accounts. It's OK if done honestly!

I find even the idea of a second account to be borderline cheating. First because it seems unnatural to register two accounts to the same person. Also, if you want to practice something, why shouldn't it reflect in your "real" rank after all?

The problem of messing with points was raised. I understand the idea of training (against bots or against volunteers) but practicing with unknowing, real players and modifying their score as a result while your real score is preserved, isn't that against the spirit of the scores? The basic principle is an exchange of points between the winner and the loser.

So yeah, a second account is acceptable if you only play against people who know about it, but how many people limit themselves to that?

I don't think this opinion is widely spread around here but hey.



Both of my accounts are ranked and are within 10 points of eachother so my score has not been preserved. There is absolutely no deception here to anybody. If I were to set up a guest account and play it at this point (and maybe this is what you're talking about), then yes that wouldn't be right because my score wouldn't reflect my playing level. I do not see as how this is borderline cheating...I think most people would agree. I'll probably drop one of the accounts when the time runs out. Till then I'm going to keep using it. Better yet, Days of Wonder can combine both of my accounts and I'll play under one name, if that's what makes everyone happy. Makes no real difference to me at this point. I've been nothing but honest about these accounts. I think Pilke would agree with my opinion...correct me if I'm wrong Pilke Very Happy
      
*player24262
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Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 17:24
léachris écrit le Wed, 01 June 2005 16:00

You know, only a few players ( the ones who read the forum) knew about these accounts.
I talked once with someone who didn't know about it and found unfair from a top player to play with a low ranked account ( he lost many points in one game ! )!

Don't worry, if I decide to play with a guest account, either it will be with anonymous, or with people I know and who will know it.


I'm really sorry if I hurt anyone with what I said, I perhaps didn't express clearly what I meant.
All I wanted to say is that only a few players read the english forum, that's all...

sorry again
      
*player100644
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May 2005
Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 19:42
br'er rabbit wrote on Wed, 01 June 2005 18:21


Both of my accounts are ranked and are within 10 points of eachother so my score has not been preserved. There is absolutely no deception here to anybody. If I were to set up a guest account and play it at this point (and maybe this is what you're talking about), then yes that wouldn't be right because my score wouldn't reflect my playing level. I do not see as how this is borderline cheating...I think most people would agree. I'll probably drop one of the accounts when the time runs out. Till then I'm going to keep using it. Better yet, Days of Wonder can combine both of my accounts and I'll play under one name, if that's what makes everyone happy. Makes no real difference to me at this point. I've been nothing but honest about these accounts. I think Pilke would agree with my opinion...correct me if I'm wrong Pilke Very Happy


Yes, your accounts are so close to each other that you can play with anyone with them. Difference in score of tiuku and pilke is bigger, but fortunately tiuku has been a good score account since the first game. I think the worst score it has had is 1616 and I have now played 35 games with it (now score 1643, rank 31th). I don't play with top ranked players with it, so nobody has lost a lot of points in one game. And I haven't played more than one game with anyone who doesn't know and accept I am pilke. And I have been as fair as I can when thinking of making and using tiuku and when trying to inform that tiuku and pilke are accounts of the same player.

[Mis à jour le: Wed, 01 June 2005 19:50]

      
yaron
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May 2005
Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 20:22
SKMorefield wrote on Wed, 01 June 2005 16:02


Not putting women down at all, because we all know there are exceptions to every 'generalization' and some women are VERY competitive and of course some men are not, your basic point about men and women being different is a fundamental truth which has often been overlooked/ignored in this age of Political Correctness.

...

and my wife just laughed at me but she wasn't surprised, because she knows as a man I am naturally competitive.


Not to put men down or anything, but the assertion that men are, in general, more competetive than women is compatiable with my experience, too.

That it is naturally so, however, is easier said than proven...
      
*player24262
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Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 20:26
redPEPPER écrit le Wed, 01 June 2005 16:55

léachris wrote:

Quote:

Anyway, as to men and women, as Leachris might say, VIVE LE DIFFERENCE!! (did I spell that right Lea?) Wink


PERFECT

If by perfect you mean that only one word out of three is incorrect, then yes, it's perfect Very Happy


Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing

To be honest, I was so amazed to read it, I only saw "vive" and "difference".
Ok, it's not "le" but "la" : typical mistake of english speaker then I don't mind Wink


      
SKMorefield
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January 2005
Re:Ranking Wed, 01 June 2005 23:00
br'er rabbit wrote on Wed, 01 June 2005 10:08

This is a very interesting post...I started the br'er rabbit account as a guest account 1) to experiment with different strategies (mainly blocking) and 2)because I did stress myself out about games on my regular account. I wasn't really very good at this point anyways, so there was no risk of screwing up people's rankings. Anyways, I found myself doing much better on my guest account playing a little less competitively. My competitive nature took over and I couldn't resist finding out the rank on this account (as I had no excel account to figure these numbers), since then I can't stop playing competitively. Sure it's stressful at times, but that's part of the fun...it is just a game. Although I do analyze the crap out of a loss as sk mentioned (he's been the cause of several of those Smile . I think SK and Peter are right, that "in general" men are much more competitive. My wife usually only wants to play T2R Europe with me anymore, as I have much less experience. Let's just say it could be a lonely night on the sofa if I pulled any "intentional" blocking stunts. To the rest...I am not so merciful!



Oh boy... my wife and I got in a real knock down drag out slobber-knocker (as Peter would say Smile) the first time I blocked her in a live game, and neither of us had played online yet! I mean, she beat me up so bad I was wishing a train had hit me instead... Wink

Well not quite but it was a pretty heated argument, about ONE block toward the end of the game on a very obvious telegraphed route! I didn't even use blocking then as a regular strategy but that one was so OBVIOUS how could I miss? It wasn't until we both got decent at the online game that she understood how effective it can be, and even does it herself now. So she has since recanted and apologized (as she should have!!! Wink)


      
thadd
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Vainqueur Nation Cup AdR 2008

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Re:Ranking Fri, 03 June 2005 02:06
Ok, let make this clear!!!

Since Lea opened the thread I played a lot of games, as before, and I lost many games.
And guess what!
I am mad!!!

I don't want to lose anymore...
So I grap out my competitiv character again. I want my points back...

Lea stop confusing me. I prefered it the way it was before.

Cu in the game!

Thad
      
*player24262
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July 2004
Re:Ranking Mon, 06 June 2005 19:46
thank you all for your help

For a couple of days, I feel better about ranking, I play for fun ( I still try to win of course Wink )

but I'm less and less stressed.

And the most funny is that now, I win , and I went up in the ranking from 44th to 17th !!! Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing

      
*player37989
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Re:Ranking Tue, 07 June 2005 23:35
I feel exactly like you!
But the last time while i read more letters in the forum, i change my mind, trying to play more and don´t think about losing points so let´s see what the future brings ..
it is only a short time you like playing the game, so anyway i think in one or two years it doesn´t matter where I stands in the ranking. So let´s play and have fun. Cool
      
*player24262
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Re:Ranking Wed, 08 June 2005 00:14
Wernerus écrit le Tue, 07 June 2005 23:35

i change my mind, trying to play more and don't think about losing points

wernerus , it's perfect for me Wink

do you remember we have to play together in the next round of the tournament

let's have fun and don't be afraid to lose against me !! Wink



      
plcrams
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January 2005
Re:Ranking Wed, 08 June 2005 01:02
léachris wrote on Tue, 07 June 2005 03:46




And the most funny is that now, I win , and I went up in the ranking from 44th to 17th !!!




Which was your plan all along, wasn't it!

So competitive!
      
    
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